ARMv8 cleanliness

Article: Microservers must Specialize to Survive
By: Jouni Osmala (josmala.delete@this.cc.hut.fi), February 5, 2013 7:59 am
Room: Moderated Discussions
Etienne (etienne_lorrain.delete@this.yahoo.fr) on February 5, 2013 6:57 am wrote:
> Jouni Osmala (josmala.delete@this.cc.hut.fi) on February 4, 2013 11:15 pm wrote:
> > Almost decade ago I defined architecture with instead of mask it counted the skips and
> > nullified. What I figured out during the exercise that register renaming becomes a
> > problematic with this kind of instructions.
> > I think the conditional move instruction brings most of the benefits with far
> > less problems.
>
> I fail to understand the problem, care to provide an example?

When you rename registers, the registers after pipeline are not same as register before register renaming stage. In register renaming the registers are changed from what programmer sees to a (physical or something else in some experiments) before instructions entering OoO core. Now the point of nullification usefulness is at execution stage and in reservation stations, far after register renaming. So you cannot just nullify it, and need to replace it with movement from old value to new value, and that reservation station or execution unit still needs the OLD value as additional dependency and dependency on branch instruction.Now the dependency check in OoO hardware is quite large piece, and its size is suddenly doubled. And that not counting the hardware that needs to be close to there for replacing on a branch the specific locations in the buffer with different instructions.

Now what if there are multiple branches. Remember that there should be 60 instructions in between front of pipeline and the time when first one is executed and sometimes there is even more old instructions in which one instruction waits main memory and everything that is dependent on it waits for it and so on.

if(a) {
blaahh..
if(b){
bluuu
}
}
noob.
Then all the instructions in bluuu are dependent on BOTH A and B branch, and old values of blaah and before branch. And instructions in noob have dependencies in all those.
The conditional move make those dependencies separate instructions, that are explicit and don't require much extra hardware. The branching handles this by guessing and unrolling if any of the guesses where wrong. And that unroll hardware is something that needs to be in the pipeline anyway.




> Why is it incompatible with register renaming? Rename what I call "NOP" with
> a "conditional move" where you know the condition is false and that would
> release the entry in the physical register file.
> The problem of the condition bits of the flag register is that they may have
> an effect a long time after the "test/add" instruction, and that may delay the
> retirement of other instructions - but in practice most condition bits are used
> just few instructions after they are calculated (if they are ever used).
> With the system I describe (I am not a processor designer), you do not get rid
> of the flags register because you still have to store the interrupt enable bit,
> and the NOPify mask in case of exception/interrupt, but you decide which instruction
> to execute and which to NOPify very early, you get rid of status flag dependencies.
> Obviously then the "add with carry" becomes a bit more complex because that will
> involve a possibly NOPified increment, but isn't that simpler than managing bits
> which may or may not have an effect later on?
>
> Etienne.

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                "Just recompile"Michael S2013/02/05 10:35 AM
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                                                          Thank you very much!Paul A. Clayton2013/03/07 07:59 PM
                                                            Thank you very much!David Hess2013/03/07 11:22 PM
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                                                                    Thank you very much!David Hess2013/03/08 08:47 PM
                                                            Thank you very much!Ricardo B2013/03/08 05:07 AM
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                                                      ParityLinus Torvalds2013/03/03 03:06 PM
                                                        ParityAndi Kleen2013/03/03 07:15 PM
                                            Except the borrow bitMatthew D2013/02/26 12:07 AM
                                              Except the borrow bitrwessel2013/02/26 12:42 AM
                                              Except the borrow bitLinus Torvalds2013/02/26 11:13 AM
                                                are ZSCO flags really fundamental?Michael S2013/02/27 04:24 PM
                                                  are ZSCO flags really fundamental?Linus Torvalds2013/02/27 05:41 PM
                                                    are ZSCO flags really fundamental?Michael S2013/02/28 01:39 AM
                                                    are ZSCO flags really fundamental?2013/03/01 10:23 AM
                                                  are ZSCO flags really fundamental?EduardoS2013/02/27 11:07 PM
                                                    are ZSCO flags really fundamental?Michael S2013/02/28 04:58 AM
                                                  are ZSCO flags really fundamental?rwessel2013/02/28 12:29 AM
                                                    are ZSCO flags really fundamental?rwessel2013/02/28 12:32 AM
                                                    Bit numbering on big endian machinesKonrad Schwarz2013/02/28 01:49 AM
                                                      Bit numbering on big endian machinesrwessel2013/02/28 02:32 AM
                                          ARMv8 cleanlinessWilco2013/02/25 05:54 AM
                                            ARMv8 cleanlinessEduardoS2013/02/25 06:24 AM
                                              ARMv8 cleanlinessWilco2013/02/25 07:36 AM
                                                ARMv8 cleanlinessEduardoS2013/02/25 01:06 PM
                                                  ARMv8 cleanlinessWilco2013/02/25 05:24 PM
                                                    ARMv8 cleanlinessEduardoS2013/02/25 05:55 PM
                                                    Utility of data loss exceptionsPaul A. Clayton2013/02/25 08:18 PM
                                                      Utility of data loss exceptionsrwessel2013/02/26 01:00 AM
                                                        Excessively expensive mode changingPaul A. Clayton2013/02/26 06:15 AM
                                                      Utility of data loss exceptionsEduardoS2013/02/26 02:55 AM
                                                        Utility of data loss exceptionsTREZA2013/02/26 04:53 AM
                                                          Utility of data loss exceptionsEduardoS2013/02/26 05:37 AM
                                                      Utility of data loss exceptionsEtienne2013/02/26 06:01 AM
                                            1b vs. 4b not a huge difference?Paul A. Clayton2013/02/25 09:57 AM
                                  Possible benefit of multi-bit CCPaul A. Clayton2013/02/23 08:09 AM
                                ARMv8 cleanlinessrwessel2013/02/18 12:01 AM
                                  ARMv8 cleanlinessWilco2013/02/18 05:33 PM
                                    ARMv8 cleanlinessEduardoS2013/02/18 08:18 PM
                                      ARMv8 cleanlinessWilco2013/02/25 06:19 AM
                      ARMv8 cleanlinessTREZA2013/02/15 04:21 AM
                      ARMv8 cleanliness2013/02/17 10:49 AM
                        ARMv8 cleanlinessLinus Torvalds2013/02/17 11:54 AM
                          ARMv8 cleanlinessLinus Torvalds2013/02/17 11:58 AM
                          ARMv8 cleanlinessnone2013/02/17 04:36 PM
                        ARMv8 cleanlinessTREZA2013/02/17 11:59 AM
                          ARMv8 cleanlinessWilco2013/02/17 12:30 PM
                            and-compare and or-comparePaul A. Clayton2013/02/17 05:28 PM
                              early branch resolutionanon2013/02/18 02:05 AM
                                My ignorance about compilers is vasterPaul A. Clayton2013/02/18 01:30 PM
                                early branch resolutionanon2013/02/18 05:12 PM
                              early branch resolution?EBFE2013/02/19 01:03 AM
                                Early resolution: some but limited potentialPaul A. Clayton2013/02/19 05:52 PM
                                  Early resolution: some but limited potentialhobold2013/02/20 02:02 PM
                                    PPC750 was an inspirationPaul A. Clayton2013/02/23 08:09 AM
                          ARMv8 cleanlinessTREZA2013/02/17 01:53 PM
                            ARMv8 cleanlinessExophase2013/02/17 04:49 PM
                        ARMv8 cleanlinessWilco2013/02/17 12:07 PM
                        ARMv8 cleanlinessbakaneko2013/02/17 12:43 PM
                        ARMv8 cleanlinessJouni Osmala2013/02/17 01:10 PM
                          -1 comparison true seems betterPaul A. Clayton2013/02/17 06:07 PM
                  ARMv8 cleanlinessEtienne2013/07/17 02:58 AM
      ARM server benchmark- why Apache?Per Hesselgren2013/02/05 12:13 AM
        ARM server benchmark- why Apache?anon2013/02/05 12:38 AM
          ARM server benchmark- why Apache?Per Hesselgren2013/02/05 01:25 AM
            ARM server benchmark- why Apache?Michael S2013/02/05 02:13 AM
          ARM server benchmark- why Apache?Michael S2013/02/05 01:51 AM
          I think that was debunked alreadyDavid Kanter2013/02/05 07:36 PM
        ARM server benchmark- why Apache?bakaneko2013/02/06 02:37 AM
          ARM server benchmark- why Apache?Michael S2013/02/06 03:43 AM
            Marketing to PHBs?Paul A. Clayton2013/02/06 06:40 AM
            ARM server benchmark- why Apache?bakaneko2013/02/06 07:08 AM
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