Knights Landing CPU Speculation

Article: Knights Landing CPU Speculation
By: Eric (eric.kjellen.delete@this.gmail.com), November 19, 2013 7:36 pm
Room: Moderated Discussions
Daniel (x.delete@this.y.z) on November 19, 2013 3:28 am wrote:
> Eric (eric.kjellen.delete@this.gmail.com) on November 18, 2013 1:17 pm wrote:
> > David Kanter (dkanter.delete@this.realworldtech.com) on November 18, 2013 3:03 am wrote:
> > > Knights Landing is Intel’s first clean sheet redesign of the Larrabee family, targeted at throughput
> > > computing and manufactured on a 14nm process with products expected in late 2014 or early 2015.
> > > The adoption of AVX3, on-package embedded DRAM, and bootable products have been disclosed, but
> > > most details are unknown. This article analyzes the options available for the Knights Landing
> > > CPU core and explains why Intel’s existing cores are a poor fit for the target workloads, concluding
> > > that the most likely outcome is a new custom core for Knights Landing.
> > >
> > > http://www.realworldtech.com/knights-landing-cpu-speculation/
> > >
> > > Questions, comments and discussion are welcome!
> > >
> > > David
> >
> > Great article, about one my favorite areas in this field. I recalled another article I read where
> > some Intel executive stated that future versions of what would be Xeon Phi were going to be based
> > on Atom cores and I found one in The Register from 2011 where Justin Rattner does address this issue:
> > "But in the future, MIC will be based on Atom cores, and then the integer gap between Xeon and MIC
> > will start to close." http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/09/15/intel_rattner_mic_coprocessor/
> >
> > So going by this and by what you said about Bonnell not having been productized (I don't know
> > if research silicon maybe has been fabbed though) on 22nm or 14nm, presumably upcoming Xeon
> > Phi generations have been developed in parallel with and in connection to development on the
> > future Atom cores (i.e. not Bonnell) and the KNC cores cores will be based on them, but as in
> > the case of the P54C derivative extended with a 512-bit vector unit and other adaptations.
>
> Heise (http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/Intels-Supercomputer-Beschleuniger-Xeon-Phi-mit-72-Kernen-integriertem-InfiniBand-und-3-TFlops-DGEMM-2049668.html)
> claims KNL using 72 Cores based on an extended Silvermont architecture now featuring OoO FPUs. I wonder how reliable
> their Sources are, because ~3TF with just 72 Cores would result in (boost) clocks above 2.5GHz.
>

Very nice find. It says that Intel will release more information at SC13 on Wednesday (November 20th I guess). KNL is also claimed to feature 8-16 GB of stacked DRAM with up to 500 GB/s bandwidth, aside from a hexa-channel DDR4 interface to up to 384 GB of memory with bandwidth of 100 GB/s. The 72 core number seems strange as it does like you say make a high clock frequency a requirement which would appear to sacrifice too much efficiency for a parallel design; on the other hand I'm not sure how else they would as Atom cores are inherently larger and more capable than the P54C cores KNF and KNC were based on.

Also, this makes me wonder if as has been previously indicated, future Xeon Phi (including Knights Landing) are supposed to go no only into PCI-E slots but also into the same sockets as Xeon, then if the hexa-channel DDR4 interface referred to here (though as I recall DDR4 does not use channels in the same sense that DDR3 does) in any way speaks to the memory interface that future Xeon CPUs will be equipped with? The direction Intel is taking appears to be a two-tiered approach (if not three-tiered including cache in the Atom cores) of on-package stacked DRAM and then external DRAM in DIMMs that will presumably be accessed coherently with standard Xeon processors on the same motherboard.
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TopicPosted ByDate
Knights Landing CPU SpeculationDavid Kanter2013/11/18 02:03 AM
  Knights Landing CPU Speculationnone2013/11/18 02:59 AM
    Knights Landing CPU SpeculationPatrick Chase2013/11/23 03:18 PM
      Knights Landing CPU SpeculationAdam Kalisz2013/11/26 01:20 AM
        Over 2,000 mm^2 of eDRAM???Mark Roulo2013/11/26 09:28 AM
          Over 2,000 mm^2 of eDRAM???David Kanter2013/11/26 11:09 AM
          Over 2,000 mm^2 of eDRAM???Eric Bron2013/11/26 11:21 AM
            Over 2,000 mm^2 of eDRAM???tarlinian2013/11/26 11:50 AM
              Over 2,000 mm^2 of eDRAM???Eric Bron2013/11/26 01:07 PM
                Over 2,000 mm^2 of eDRAM???Eric Bron2013/11/26 01:09 PM
                Over 2,000 mm^2 of eDRAM???aaron spink2013/11/26 03:03 PM
                  Over 2,000 mm^2 of eDRAM???Eric Bron2013/11/26 11:42 PM
                    Over 2,000 mm^2 of eDRAM???aaron spink2013/11/27 10:31 AM
              Over 2,000 mm^2 of eDRAM???David Kanter2013/11/26 04:25 PM
                Over 2,000 mm^2 of eDRAM???tarlinian2013/11/26 07:01 PM
          Over 2,000 mm^2 of eDRAM???Eric2013/11/27 02:54 AM
            eDRAM is DRAM in a logic-oriented processPaul A. Clayton2013/11/27 07:10 AM
  Knights Landing CPU SpeculationJames2013/11/18 05:26 AM
    Knights Landing CPU SpeculationMichael S2013/11/18 02:57 PM
      Knights Landing CPU SpeculationUrban Novak2013/11/19 12:49 AM
        Knights Landing CPU Speculationnone2013/11/19 01:19 AM
          Knights Landing CPU SpeculationEric2013/11/19 07:48 PM
            Total GPGPU/Xeon Phi market maybe ~ $500M/year ...Mark Roulo2013/11/20 10:35 AM
      Knights Landing CPU SpeculationWes Felter2013/11/19 12:06 PM
        Knights Landing CPU SpeculationMichael S2013/11/19 12:49 PM
  Knights Landing CPU SpeculationEric2013/11/18 12:17 PM
    Knights Landing CPU SpeculationDaniel2013/11/19 02:28 AM
      Knights Landing CPU SpeculationEric2013/11/19 07:36 PM
      HPC guys score FLOPS non-obviouslyMark Roulo2013/11/20 10:43 AM
        3-TFlops-DGEMMMichael S2013/11/20 10:59 AM
          3-TFlops-DGEMMMark Roulo2013/11/20 12:22 PM
            3-TFlops-DGEMMDaniel2013/11/20 01:04 PM
              3-TFlops-DGEMMEric2013/11/21 01:28 AM
                3-TFlops-DGEMMMichael S2013/11/21 05:48 AM
                  3-TFlops-DGEMMRecessionCone2013/11/21 11:13 AM
                    3-TFlops-DGEMMMichael S2013/11/21 02:34 PM
                  3-TFlops-DGEMMEric2013/11/22 02:10 AM
                    3-TFlops-DGEMMMichael S2013/11/22 04:41 AM
                    A (not very sensible) alternative: FMADD + FADDPaul A. Clayton2013/11/22 08:19 AM
                  3-TFlops-DGEMMSylvain Collange2013/11/24 02:37 AM
                    3-TFlops-DGEMMMichael S2013/11/24 06:06 AM
                      3-TFlops-DGEMMSylvain Collange2013/11/24 09:28 AM
        HPC guys score FLOPS non-obviouslyPatrick Chase2013/11/23 02:58 PM
  Knights Landing CPU SpeculationPaul Caheny2013/11/18 01:25 PM
    Knights Landing CPU SpeculationKonrad Schwarz2013/11/19 12:24 AM
  Knights Landing CPU SpeculationAmiba Gelos2013/11/19 07:36 PM
    Knights Landing CPU SpeculationDavid Kanter2013/11/20 09:52 AM
    Knights Landing CPU SpeculationLinus Torvalds2013/11/21 02:12 PM
      Knights Landing CPU SpeculationAmiba Gelos2013/11/21 05:14 PM
      Knights Landing CPU SpeculationPatrick Chase2013/11/23 03:33 PM
        Knights Landing CPU SpeculationLinus Torvalds2013/11/25 11:29 AM
          Knights Landing CPU SpeculationLinus Torvalds2013/11/25 12:05 PM
          Knights Landing CPU SpeculationPatrick Chase2013/11/25 12:22 PM
            Knights Landing CPU SpeculationLinus Torvalds2013/11/26 10:11 AM
          Knights Landing CPU SpeculationEric2013/11/26 03:05 AM
            Knights Landing CPU SpeculationEric2013/11/26 03:15 AM
            Knights Landing CPU Speculationnone2013/11/26 03:33 AM
              Knights Landing CPU SpeculationEric2013/11/26 06:30 PM
                Knights Landing CPU SpeculationEric2013/11/26 06:34 PM
                  What is MCDRAM?anon2013/11/26 08:58 PM
                    What is MCDRAM?none2013/11/27 01:00 AM
                      What is MCDRAM?Klimax2013/11/27 02:19 AM
                  Knights Landing CPU SpeculationKlimax2013/11/26 11:06 PM
                Knights Landing CPU SpeculationKlimax2013/11/26 11:05 PM
            Knights Landing CPU Speculationanon2013/11/26 05:53 AM
              Knights Landing CPU Speculationnone2013/11/26 06:20 AM
                Knights Landing CPU SpeculationMichael S2013/11/26 08:06 AM
                  Knights Landing CPU Speculationnone2013/11/26 09:18 AM
                    Knights Landing CPU SpeculationEric Bron2013/11/26 01:21 PM
                      Knights Landing CPU SpeculationEric Bron2013/11/26 01:27 PM
                        Knights Landing CPU Speculationnone2013/11/26 02:26 PM
                    Knights Landing CPU Speculationanon2013/11/26 05:42 PM
                      Knights Landing CPU Speculationnone2013/11/27 01:08 AM
                        Knights Landing CPU Speculationanon2013/11/27 01:50 AM
                          Knights Landing CPU Speculationnone2013/11/27 01:58 AM
                      Knights Landing CPU SpeculationMichael S2013/11/27 01:25 AM
                        Knights Landing CPU Speculationanon2013/11/27 02:32 AM
                          Knights Landing CPU SpeculationMichael S2013/11/27 03:08 AM
    Knights Landing CPU SpeculationChung Leong2013/11/27 01:28 AM
      Knights Landing CPU SpeculationMichael S2013/11/27 02:53 AM
        Knights Landing CPU SpeculationChung Leong2013/11/27 01:03 PM
  BiG.LiTTLe for KNL?Jeff K2013/11/22 06:17 AM
    BiG.LiTTLe for KNL?Patrick Chase2013/11/23 02:54 PM
      BiG.LiTTLe for KNL?Patrick Chase2013/11/23 03:01 PM
  Transactional memoryPatrick Chase2013/11/23 02:37 PM
    Transactional memoryBhima2013/11/25 07:01 AM
      Transactional memoryPatrick Chase2013/11/25 11:52 AM
  Knights Landing CPU SpeculationDaniel2013/11/25 02:17 AM
    Knights Landing CPU SpeculationKlimax2013/11/25 03:12 AM
    Knights Landing CPU Speculationnone2013/11/25 04:05 AM
      Knights Landing CPU SpeculationKlimax2013/11/25 04:45 AM
        Knights Landing CPU Speculationnone2013/11/25 04:55 AM
          Knights Landing CPU Speculationgmb2013/11/25 07:21 AM
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