Flash DIMMs = bad idea

Article: Intel’s Plans for 3DXP DIMMs Emerge
By: Emil Briggs (me.delete@this.nowherespam.com), July 24, 2018 7:29 am
Room: Moderated Discussions
David Kanter (dkanter.delete@this.realworldtech.com) on July 24, 2018 6:49 am wrote:
> Emil Briggs (me.delete@this.nowherespam.com) on July 24, 2018 6:30 am wrote:
> > David Kanter (dkanter.delete@this.realworldtech.com) on July 24, 2018 4:31 am wrote:
> > > Teemo (teemo.delete@this.riot.com) on July 23, 2018 5:38 pm wrote:
> > > > David Kanter (dkanter.delete@this.realworldtech.com) on July 23, 2018 10:02 am wrote:
> > > > > In honor of our anniversary, I have a new article on Intel's 3DXP DIMMs:
> > > > >
> > > > > Intel will offer 3DXP-based DIMMs (previously codenamed Apache
> > > > > Pass) that use the DDR4 interface on the next-generation
> > > > > Cascade Lake server processor. The first DIMMs will be available in 128GB, 256GB, and 512GB capacities and
> > > > > work with a new software architecture for persistent memory.
> > > > > Intel and its partners have enabled the new persistent
> > > > > memory programming model for Java, Linux, VMware, and Windows and many customers are eagerly awaiting the
> > > > > non-volatile, high-capacity memory for in-memory databases and other applications.
> > > > >
> > > > > I also point out many of the areas Intel has been less than forthcoming,
> > > > > particularly around security and serviceability.
> > > > >
> > > > > As always - comments, questions, and feedback are appreciated.
> > > > >
> > > > > David
> > > >
> > > > Has anyone ever done a comparison of Xpoint to flash DIMMs?
> > >
> > > Flash DIMMs are an abomination. The access latency is terrible, and you still have block
> > > size mismatches. Most DDR4 fetches are going to be 64B, maybe 128B. Flash accesses are
> > > much much bigger. So you are wasting internal bandwidth. Moreover, there is always the
> > > possibility of GC, which would then tie up a DDR4 transaction for a VERY long time.
> > >
> > > Fundamentally, flash on DIMMs is a technology mismatch. 3DXP makes
> > > a lot more sense, but there is still room for improvement.
> > >
> > > From a product standpoint, Diablo memory is dead and Sandisk UltraDIMM is DDR3. So why bother?
> > >
> > > David
> >
> > If I recall correctly Micron launched a product that consisted of DDR4 dimms with a super cap and flash.
> > When power goes down the DRAM contents are written to the flash but otherwise it acts as a normal DIMM.
> >
>
> Yup, and it's about 16GB!
>
> David

In addition to Michael's point about capacity it appears to me that it might just have different use cases where it makes more sense.
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TopicPosted ByDate
New article on Intel's 3DXPDavid Kanter2018/07/23 09:02 AM
  New article on Intel's 3DXPGroo2018/07/23 12:53 PM
    New article on Intel's 3DXPMichael S2018/07/23 01:47 PM
  New article on Intel's 3DXPTeemo2018/07/23 04:38 PM
    New article on Intel's 3DXPWes Felterw2018/07/23 08:41 PM
    Flash DIMMs = bad ideaDavid Kanter2018/07/24 03:31 AM
      Flash DIMMs = bad ideaEmil Briggs2018/07/24 05:30 AM
        Flash DIMMs = bad ideaDavid Kanter2018/07/24 05:49 AM
          Flash DIMMs = bad ideaMichael S2018/07/24 05:59 AM
          Flash DIMMs = bad ideaEmil Briggs2018/07/24 07:29 AM
          Flash DIMMs = bad ideaDoug S2018/07/24 07:49 AM
            price Michael S2018/07/24 02:16 PM
              price Doug S2018/07/24 02:32 PM
                price Michael S2018/07/24 02:49 PM
            Flash DIMMs = bad ideablaine2018/12/03 03:40 PM
              Flash DIMMs = bad ideaWes Felter2018/12/04 11:07 AM
                Flash DIMMs = bad ideaRichardC2018/12/04 03:09 PM
        Flash DIMMs = bad ideaMichael S2018/07/24 05:51 AM
        Flash DIMMs = bad ideaAdrian2018/07/24 06:35 AM
          Flash DIMMs = bad ideaRicardo B2018/07/24 08:24 AM
        Flash DIMMs = bad ideabakaneko2018/07/24 05:55 PM
  New article on Intel's 3DXPEtienne2018/07/25 04:02 AM
  New article on Intel's 3DXPHoward Chu2018/12/01 05:23 AM
    New article on Intel's 3DXPMichael S2018/12/01 07:56 AM
      New article on Intel's 3DXPanon2018/12/01 08:21 AM
        New article on Intel's 3DXPHoward Chu2018/12/01 12:52 PM
          New article on Intel's 3DXPAdrian`2018/12/01 02:43 PM
            New article on Intel's 3DXPAdrian2018/12/01 10:05 PM
              New article on Intel's 3DXPHoward Chu2018/12/11 04:17 AM
                New article on Intel's 3DXPAdrian2018/12/11 04:42 AM
                New article on Intel's 3DXPMaynard Handley2018/12/11 07:20 AM
                  New article on Intel's 3DXPwumpus2018/12/11 08:36 AM
                  New article on Intel's 3DXPAnon2018/12/11 04:21 PM
                    New article on Intel's 3DXPMaynard Handley2018/12/11 04:32 PM
                      New article on Intel's 3DXPAnon2018/12/11 11:29 PM
                        New article on Intel's 3DXPMaynard Handley2018/12/12 10:32 AM
                          New article on Intel's 3DXPwumpus2018/12/12 11:07 AM
                            New article on Intel's 3DXPMaynard Handley2018/12/12 11:41 AM
                              New article on Intel's 3DXPAnon2018/12/12 02:55 PM
                          New article on Intel's 3DXPAnon2018/12/12 02:49 PM
                      New article on Intel's 3DXPAnne O. Nymous2018/12/12 12:14 AM
                        New article on Intel's 3DXPanon2018/12/12 05:28 AM
                        New article on Intel's 3DXPMaynard Handley2018/12/12 10:26 AM
                          New article on Intel's 3DXPAnne O. Nymous2018/12/12 01:10 PM
                      New article on Intel's 3DXPinnocent bystander2018/12/12 09:34 PM
                New article on Intel's 3DXPanon2018/12/12 01:42 PM
            New article on Intel's 3DXPHoward Chu2018/12/02 04:53 AM
              New article on Intel's 3DXPAdrian2018/12/02 06:01 AM
                New article on Intel's 3DXPHoward Chu2018/12/02 10:34 AM
                  Intel's 3DXP availabilityEtienne Lorrain2018/12/03 03:50 PM
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