New article on Intel's 3DXP

Article: Intel’s Plans for 3DXP DIMMs Emerge
By: Maynard Handley (name99.delete@this.name99.org), December 12, 2018 10:26 am
Room: Moderated Discussions
Anne O. Nymous (not.delete@this.real.address) on December 12, 2018 12:14 am wrote:
> Maynard Handley (name99.delete@this.name99.org) on December 11, 2018 4:32 pm wrote:
> > Anon (no.delete@this.email.com) on December 11, 2018 4:21 pm wrote:
> > > Maynard Handley (name99.delete@this.name99.org) on December 11, 2018 7:20 am wrote:
> > > >......
> > > > The crypto has to be appropriate to the problem. This is NOT the equivalent of network crypto.
> > > > For example, suppose the equivalent of a random key burned into the device is XOR'd with everything
> > > > going into and out of an MRAM cache (maybe also XOR-in the relevant addresses).
> > > > Is that good enough? On the off-chance that someone could extract the contents
> > > > of the MRAM cache (which may or may not be true?) the assumption is always
> > > > that they CANNOT extract the contents of these sorts of hardware keys.
> > >
> > > Such a scheme would be about as secure as writing a key on a yellow postit on your monitor.
> >
> > Why do you say that?
> > This is not a situation where one can watch a constant stream of data and extract statistics.
> > My threat model is that someone steals a laptop, delids the chip, and has access to the
> > frozen contents of the MRAM data. Not even the cache tags, just a collection of lines
> > of data; and not a constant, changing, stream of data as the CPU executes.
>
> Mmmh, but could said attacker not try to log-in for a few times to make sure that known
> code (from the login routine) resides in the cache (and maybe do a memory snapshot before
> and after and compare). And then the proposed single static key is 'toast', no?
>

But now you are assuming a totally different threat model! That's my point.

MY assumption was that we have a laptop that's fully protected by current means (so imagine, eg, an Apple laptop with login and flash protected by the T2 and full-disk encryption). We're assuming as given that you have no control over the laptop; the ONLY thing that's new is the assumption that you can delid the SoC and read out the (uncontrolled, but persistent) contents of the MRAM data.
If your starting point is that you have login control of the laptop, then what's new about the MRAM? You have login control, what more do you want!
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TopicPosted ByDate
New article on Intel's 3DXPDavid Kanter2018/07/23 09:02 AM
  New article on Intel's 3DXPGroo2018/07/23 12:53 PM
    New article on Intel's 3DXPMichael S2018/07/23 01:47 PM
  New article on Intel's 3DXPTeemo2018/07/23 04:38 PM
    New article on Intel's 3DXPWes Felterw2018/07/23 08:41 PM
    Flash DIMMs = bad ideaDavid Kanter2018/07/24 03:31 AM
      Flash DIMMs = bad ideaEmil Briggs2018/07/24 05:30 AM
        Flash DIMMs = bad ideaDavid Kanter2018/07/24 05:49 AM
          Flash DIMMs = bad ideaMichael S2018/07/24 05:59 AM
          Flash DIMMs = bad ideaEmil Briggs2018/07/24 07:29 AM
          Flash DIMMs = bad ideaDoug S2018/07/24 07:49 AM
            price Michael S2018/07/24 02:16 PM
              price Doug S2018/07/24 02:32 PM
                price Michael S2018/07/24 02:49 PM
            Flash DIMMs = bad ideablaine2018/12/03 03:40 PM
              Flash DIMMs = bad ideaWes Felter2018/12/04 11:07 AM
                Flash DIMMs = bad ideaRichardC2018/12/04 03:09 PM
        Flash DIMMs = bad ideaMichael S2018/07/24 05:51 AM
        Flash DIMMs = bad ideaAdrian2018/07/24 06:35 AM
          Flash DIMMs = bad ideaRicardo B2018/07/24 08:24 AM
        Flash DIMMs = bad ideabakaneko2018/07/24 05:55 PM
  New article on Intel's 3DXPEtienne2018/07/25 04:02 AM
  New article on Intel's 3DXPHoward Chu2018/12/01 05:23 AM
    New article on Intel's 3DXPMichael S2018/12/01 07:56 AM
      New article on Intel's 3DXPanon2018/12/01 08:21 AM
        New article on Intel's 3DXPHoward Chu2018/12/01 12:52 PM
          New article on Intel's 3DXPAdrian`2018/12/01 02:43 PM
            New article on Intel's 3DXPAdrian2018/12/01 10:05 PM
              New article on Intel's 3DXPHoward Chu2018/12/11 04:17 AM
                New article on Intel's 3DXPAdrian2018/12/11 04:42 AM
                New article on Intel's 3DXPMaynard Handley2018/12/11 07:20 AM
                  New article on Intel's 3DXPwumpus2018/12/11 08:36 AM
                  New article on Intel's 3DXPAnon2018/12/11 04:21 PM
                    New article on Intel's 3DXPMaynard Handley2018/12/11 04:32 PM
                      New article on Intel's 3DXPAnon2018/12/11 11:29 PM
                        New article on Intel's 3DXPMaynard Handley2018/12/12 10:32 AM
                          New article on Intel's 3DXPwumpus2018/12/12 11:07 AM
                            New article on Intel's 3DXPMaynard Handley2018/12/12 11:41 AM
                              New article on Intel's 3DXPAnon2018/12/12 02:55 PM
                          New article on Intel's 3DXPAnon2018/12/12 02:49 PM
                      New article on Intel's 3DXPAnne O. Nymous2018/12/12 12:14 AM
                        New article on Intel's 3DXPanon2018/12/12 05:28 AM
                        New article on Intel's 3DXPMaynard Handley2018/12/12 10:26 AM
                          New article on Intel's 3DXPAnne O. Nymous2018/12/12 01:10 PM
                      New article on Intel's 3DXPinnocent bystander2018/12/12 09:34 PM
                New article on Intel's 3DXPanon2018/12/12 01:42 PM
            New article on Intel's 3DXPHoward Chu2018/12/02 04:53 AM
              New article on Intel's 3DXPAdrian2018/12/02 06:01 AM
                New article on Intel's 3DXPHoward Chu2018/12/02 10:34 AM
                  Intel's 3DXP availabilityEtienne Lorrain2018/12/03 03:50 PM
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