Chicken or egg, both.

By: Magagop (xxx.delete@this.xxx.com), February 24, 2019 11:18 pm
Room: Moderated Discussions
Ronald Maas (ronaldjmaas.delete@this.gmail.com) on February 23, 2019 5:33 pm wrote:
> David Soul (hd4lys+4s3zx2rexne0k.delete@this.sharklasers.com) on February 22, 2019 5:05 pm wrote:
> > Your right,so why have you not looked around and seen all the
> > big company's all moving in some fashion to implement ARM.
> > "HP announced two ARM-powered servers, including the first enterprise-class 64-bit ARM server,
> > to expand customer choice for compute with targeted solutions for selected workloads."
> >
> > Japans new supercomputer uses ARM.
> > https://www.fujitsu.com/global/Images/post-k-supercomputer-overview.pdf
> >
> > Huawei Unveils New Chipset Using Arm Design for Server Push
> > JAN 07, 2019
> > AWS Launches Cloud Instances Powered by Custom Arm Chips
> > NOV 27, 2018
> > HPE and DOE Partner to Build Largest ARM-Based Supercomputer
> > JUN 22, 2018
> > https://www.datacenterknowledge.com
> >
> > Dell,HP,IBM,Google,Facebook,Amazon,Baidu etc the list goes,all these
> > companys are said to have started to invest in ARM servers.
> > Softbank group bought ARM for $32 billion,because they think it's
> > a dead tech? No because your watch,smartphone,tv,fridge,smart
> > home,smart car,video door bell,SBC's,cube sats (you get the point) all use ARM.
> >
> > ==============================
> >
>
>
> Problem is when I search Amazon or Newegg for 'ThunderX2', I got offers for a gaming chair. Searching for 'ARM
> Server' returns a ARM based tinker board, and finally 'X-Gene' an album of an artist I never heard of.
>
> So one critical requirements for ARM to have success in the server space is a wide range
> of ARM based development and server hardware to buy, and have the confidence that these
> products exist one or two years from now. I fully agree with Linus on this.
>
> Second the TCO for ARM should be significant lower compared to x86. It is nice AWS offers ARM based
> instances, but quick price check seems these are about 20% more expensive compared to Intel Xeon.
>
> Third single thread CPU performance and uncore performance (memory bandwidth, latency,
> etc.) should be good enough for the majority of enterprise applications to run successfully.
> Fortunately most Xeons sold are not exactly speed demons, and from what I have read about
> ThunderX2 and now Neoverse N1, So I think we are getting there in that regard.
>
> Personally I like to see ARM to become a success in the server space. But with points 1) and
> 2) seriously lacking at the moment, I think it will be a hard sell to convince businesses
> to consider ARM as a viable alternative for x86. Will be at least a few years from now.
>
> Ronald
>

That you cannot blame Arm, whose business is only selling IP to SoC providers.
Arm is NOT Intel or IBM, it cannot and will not sell chips or laptops or servers directly...
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ARM announces Aresnobody in particular2019/02/20 08:35 AM
  ARM announces AresAdrian2019/02/20 08:39 AM
    ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 10:03 AM
      ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/20 10:41 AM
        ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 12:49 PM
          ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/20 01:21 PM
            ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 02:01 PM
              ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 02:31 PM
                ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 03:16 PM
                  ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 03:49 PM
                    ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 04:09 PM
                      ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 04:45 PM
                        ARM announces Aresnobody in particular2019/02/20 04:55 PM
                          ARM announces AresDan Fay2019/02/20 05:44 PM
                            ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 07:06 PM
                              ARM announces AresDan Fay2019/02/21 08:27 AM
                        ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 05:49 PM
                          ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 06:40 PM
                            ARM announces AresCharles2019/02/21 02:16 AM
                              ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 02:26 AM
                        ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/20 08:55 PM
                          ARM announces AresJS2019/02/21 12:59 AM
                            *has not hasn't (NT)JS2019/02/21 01:01 AM
                            ARM announces AresSalvatore De Dominicis2019/02/21 07:05 AM
                        Definitions of RISCBrendan2019/02/21 10:07 AM
                          Definitions of RISCMichael S2019/02/21 10:16 AM
                          PDP-8 Not Usually Considered RISCMark Roulo2019/02/21 02:10 PM
                            PDP-8 Not Usually Considered RISCrwessel2019/02/21 07:13 PM
                          Definitions of RISCAdrian2019/02/21 02:42 PM
                            Definitions of RISC (nod to John Mashey and comp.arch)wumpus2019/02/21 06:29 PM
                              Definitions of RISC (nod to John Mashey and comp.arch)none2019/02/22 12:32 AM
                                Definitions of RISC (nod to John Mashey and comp.arch)Michael S2019/02/22 04:28 AM
                                  Definitions of RISC (nod to John Mashey and comp.arch)none2019/02/22 08:01 AM
  ARM announces Areslockederboss2019/02/20 09:56 AM
    stability? (NT)anonymous22019/02/20 10:01 AM
    ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 10:05 AM
    ARM announces AresGroo2019/02/20 10:11 AM
    ARM announces AresAndrei Frumusanu2019/02/20 11:49 AM
  ARM announces AresLinus Torvalds2019/02/20 10:36 AM
    ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/20 10:54 AM
    ARM announces AresGeoff Langdale2019/02/20 03:07 PM
      ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 03:32 PM
      ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/21 12:03 AM
        That last line should have been removed :-) (NT)none2019/02/21 12:04 AM
        ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 01:47 AM
          ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/21 03:59 AM
            ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 04:45 AM
            ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/21 05:18 AM
              ARM announces AresSimon Farnsworth2019/02/22 09:43 AM
    ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/20 09:27 PM
      ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 01:53 AM
        ARM announces AresLinus Torvalds2019/02/21 09:03 AM
          ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 09:35 AM
            ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 09:51 AM
            ARM announces AresFoo_2019/02/21 02:40 PM
            ARM announces Aresaaron spink2019/02/21 03:56 PM
            ARM announces AresLinus Torvalds2019/02/21 04:27 PM
              ARM announces AresStoffels2019/02/22 12:21 AM
                ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/22 04:15 AM
                  ARM announces AresSimon Farnsworth2019/02/22 09:41 AM
                    ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/22 10:30 AM
                    In other words: nobody will ever get fired for choosing x86 (NT)Gabriele Svelto2019/02/24 01:32 PM
                      In other words: nobody will ever get fired for choosing x86Simon Farnsworth2019/02/25 04:53 AM
              ARM announces AresFoo_2019/02/22 02:52 AM
              ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/24 01:31 PM
                ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/25 03:57 AM
                  ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/25 04:21 AM
                    ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/25 04:58 AM
                      ARM announces Aresnobody in particular2019/02/25 05:21 AM
                        ARM announces AresAdrian2019/02/26 08:02 AM
                    ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/26 12:32 AM
                      ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/26 12:14 PM
                      ARM announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/19 05:34 PM
                    ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/26 01:34 AM
                      ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/26 12:16 PM
                        ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/27 12:19 AM
              ARM announces Aresend of an era2019/02/24 03:18 PM
                Word salad bot strikes again (NT)nanon2019/02/25 12:26 AM
                ARM announces Areshobel2019/02/25 02:10 AM
                  ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/25 02:52 AM
                    ARM announces Areshobel2019/02/25 10:48 AM
                      ARM announces AresAndrew Clough2019/02/25 02:07 PM
                      ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/26 12:38 AM
                    ARM announces AresJohn Yates2019/02/26 03:43 PM
              ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 06:55 AM
              ARM announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/19 05:22 PM
            ARM announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/19 04:54 PM
              ARMY announces Aresdmcq2019/03/20 03:12 AM
                ARMY announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/20 05:47 AM
                  ARMY announces Aresdmcq2019/03/20 06:05 AM
          ARM announces AresGroo2019/02/21 10:23 AM
            ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 10:29 AM
              ARM announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/19 05:44 PM
            ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/02/21 11:52 AM
            ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/21 08:19 PM
              ARM announces Areshobel2019/02/22 03:40 AM
          software ecosystemsRichardC2019/02/21 04:31 PM
            software ecosystemsFoo_2019/02/22 03:15 AM
          ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/21 05:31 PM
            + on hyperscalingdmcq2019/02/22 08:23 AM
              + on hyperscalingMaynard Handley2019/02/22 08:38 AM
                + on hyperscalingjuanrga2019/02/22 11:57 AM
            + on hyperscalingdmcq2019/02/22 08:23 AM
              sorry duplicatedmcq2019/02/22 08:26 AM
          ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/21 08:34 PM
            ARM announces AresBrett2019/02/21 10:20 PM
          ARM announces AresA. Wilcox2019/02/22 03:52 PM
  ARM announces AresDoug S2019/02/20 03:30 PM
    ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 04:14 PM
      ARM announces AresDoug S2019/02/21 08:40 AM
        ARM announces Aresaaron spink2019/02/21 04:05 PM
        ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/22 08:48 AM
  ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/02/21 02:28 AM
    ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 03:25 AM
      ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/02/22 04:09 AM
      ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/22 08:51 AM
        ARM announces AresDavid Soul2019/02/22 11:47 AM
          ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/02/22 12:23 PM
            Chicken or egg, both.Brett2019/02/22 02:21 PM
              Chicken or egg, both.David Soul2019/02/22 06:05 PM
                Chicken or egg, both.Brett2019/02/22 09:55 PM
                  ARM salesjuanrga2019/02/23 03:55 AM
                    ARM salesaaron spink2019/02/23 08:47 AM
                Chicken or egg, both.Ronald Maas2019/02/23 06:33 PM
                  Chicken or egg, both.Magagop2019/02/24 11:18 PM
                    why not? (NT)Michael S2019/02/25 02:03 AM
                      why not?Not the parent2019/02/25 10:36 AM
                        why not?Michael S2019/02/25 10:43 AM
                          why not?dmcq2019/02/25 11:35 AM
                            why not?Michael S2019/02/25 12:03 PM
                              why not?dmcq2019/02/25 12:29 PM
                              why not?Not the parent2019/02/26 10:08 AM
                                why not?Doug S2019/02/26 12:05 PM
                                  why not?Not the parent2019/02/27 04:51 AM
                                    why not?Doug S2019/02/27 12:15 PM
                                      why not?Not the parent2019/02/28 01:43 AM
                                why not?anon2019/02/26 11:22 PM
                                  why not?Not the parent2019/02/27 04:59 AM
                                    why not?anon2019/02/27 06:42 AM
                                      why not?Magagop2019/02/27 03:31 PM
                                        why not?anon2019/02/27 05:02 PM
                                          why not?dmcq2019/02/27 05:25 PM
                                            why not?anon2019/02/27 05:56 PM
                                              why not?dmcq2019/02/27 06:19 PM
                                                why not?anon2019/02/27 06:46 PM
                                                  why not?Wilco2019/02/28 05:49 AM
                                                    why not?Jukka Larja2019/02/28 07:02 AM
                                                      why not?Michael S2019/02/28 08:32 AM
                                                      why not?Wilco2019/02/28 09:40 AM
                                                      why not?Doug S2019/02/28 10:13 AM
                                                        why not?Foo_2019/03/01 07:35 AM
                                                          why not?Doug S2019/03/01 11:05 AM
                                                            why not?anon2019/03/01 02:32 PM
                                                              why not?dmcq2019/03/01 03:13 PM
                                                                why not?anon2019/03/01 04:13 PM
                                                                  why not?dmcq2019/03/02 03:56 AM
                                                                    why not?anon2019/03/02 10:09 AM
                                                                      why not?dmcq2019/03/02 10:41 AM
                                                                        why not?anon2019/03/02 12:19 PM
                                                                          why not?dmcq2019/03/03 03:48 AM
                                                                      why not?Doug S2019/03/02 04:53 PM
                                                                        why not?Michael S2019/03/02 05:06 PM
                                                                          why not?Doug S2019/03/03 12:54 AM
                                                                            why not?Michael S2019/03/03 02:58 AM
                                                                              why not?anon2019/03/03 05:35 AM
                                                                                why not?dmcq2019/03/03 06:33 AM
                                                                                  I considired dry humor a Brittish specialty. It seems, I was wrong about it. (NT)Michael S2019/03/03 06:39 AM
                                                                                  why not?anon2019/03/03 10:13 AM
                                                                                    why not?Michael S2019/03/03 12:41 PM
                                                                                      why not?dmcq2019/03/03 01:21 PM
                                                                                        why not?anon2019/03/03 04:15 PM
                                                    why not?anon2019/02/28 08:38 PM
                                              why not?Not the parent2019/02/28 01:48 AM
                                                strawman (NT)anon2019/02/28 08:31 PM
                            why not?Michael S2019/02/27 03:53 AM
                              why not?Not the parent2019/02/27 05:26 AM
                                why not?Michael S2019/02/27 05:42 AM
                              why not?dmcq2019/02/27 05:49 AM
                                why not?Michael S2019/02/27 06:21 AM
                                  why not?dmcq2019/02/27 07:15 AM
                                Selling at multiple layersPaul A. Clayton2019/02/27 11:25 AM
                                  Selling at multiple layersDoug S2019/02/27 12:45 PM
                                    Selling at multiple layersPaul A. Clayton2019/02/27 02:32 PM
                                      Selling at multiple layersDoug S2019/02/27 04:04 PM
                                        Paul A. Clayton2019/02/27 07:06 PM
                                          Arm reference board?Simon Farnsworth2019/02/28 12:34 PM
                                why not?Doug S2019/02/27 12:46 PM
                      why not? (NT)la mama de murgay2019/02/25 10:22 PM
                    Chicken or egg, both.Ronald Maas2019/02/25 01:23 PM
            ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/24 03:07 PM
              ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/03/02 05:40 AM
                ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/03/02 08:08 AM
                  ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/03/02 10:10 AM
          ARM announces Areshobel2019/02/22 04:33 PM
            ARM announces AresDavid Soul2019/02/22 06:20 PM
              TrollDoug S2019/02/23 01:37 AM
                TrollDavid Soul2019/02/23 08:59 AM
              ARM announces AresEnnis2019/02/23 02:18 AM
                ARM announces AresFoo_2019/02/23 02:38 AM
                  ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/23 03:46 AM
                ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/23 05:41 AM
  ARM announces Aresnobody in particular2019/02/26 03:58 AM
    expensiveanonymous22019/02/27 12:46 AM
    ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 07:19 AM
      ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 07:21 AM
        ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/27 07:57 AM
        ARM announces AresJukka Larja2019/02/27 08:11 AM
          ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/27 08:16 AM
            ARM announces AresDoug S2019/02/27 12:49 PM
              ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/27 01:43 PM
                ARM announces AresDoug S2019/02/27 04:06 PM
                  ARM announces AresGian-Carlo Pascutto2019/02/28 05:00 AM
                ARM announces AresGian-Carlo Pascutto2019/02/28 05:02 AM
                  ARM announces AresMichael S2019/03/01 03:47 AM
                    death by a thousand cutsMichael S2019/03/01 07:27 AM
                      death by a thousand cutsFoo_2019/03/01 07:37 AM
                        death by a thousand cutsdmcq2019/03/01 12:10 PM
              ARM announces AresJukka Larja2019/02/28 06:31 AM
                ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/28 09:17 AM
                  ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/28 03:02 PM
                    ARM announces Aresaaron spink2019/03/01 01:19 AM
                ARM announces AresAndrew Clough2019/02/28 11:32 AM
                  ARM announces AresAndrew Clough2019/02/28 11:33 AM
                  ARM announces AresFoo_2019/03/01 01:55 AM
                  ARM announces AresJukka Larja2019/03/01 05:40 AM
          ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 08:45 AM
            ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/27 09:17 AM
              ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/27 09:21 AM
                ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 04:03 PM
            ARM announces AresJukka Larja2019/02/28 06:03 AM
      ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/27 11:49 PM
        ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/28 04:26 AM
          ARM announces AresPeter E. Fry2019/02/28 07:31 PM
            ARM announces AresAdrian2019/02/28 10:09 PM
            ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/03/02 12:56 AM
              ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/03/02 10:05 AM
                ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/03/02 02:31 PM
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