ARM announces Ares

By: Jukka Larja (roskakori2006.delete@this.gmail.com), February 28, 2019 6:03 am
Room: Moderated Discussions
Howard Chu (hyc.delete@this.symas.com) on February 27, 2019 7:45 am wrote:
> Jukka Larja (roskakori2006.delete@this.gmail.com) on February 27, 2019 7:11 am wrote:
> > Howard Chu (hyc.delete@this.symas.com) on February 27, 2019 6:21 am wrote:
> >
> > > Note - 2GB is actually plenty to be productive in C. It's not enough
> > > for parallel compiles of C++ unfortunately. IMO this is the fault of C++,
> > > not of the ARM boxes.
> >
> > Unfortunately 2 GB isn't enough for the browser I need to run
> > to be able to write anything non-trivial with any language.
> >
> > (Not that I would be in the market for an ARM box even if they were a bit faster than
> > x86 ones. However, I find it absurd that 2 GBs is considered "plenty" for any use.)
>
> I find it absurd that anyone needs to run a browser just to write code.
> I do all my coding in vi (vim actually). It should worry you if you need
> to load up a multi-GB environment just to edit a couple-KB source file.

I find it amazing that some people can seemingly work with vi or vim and get things done. I'm OK with GUI text editor, but even though such things didn't exists when I started to program (for fun. I've only done it for work since 2009), they are about as low as I can go. On Nano or Emacs my productivity is hampered. On vi or vim I need to google things like how to save or quit, even though I've googled them dozen times already. I can't comprehend how people remember more than few shortcut commands, no matter what software they use.

People are different, but as far as I can see, I'm much more common example of a programmer than the few vim users. I did do some assembler programming in early 90s using Q editor, downloaded docs and a book. It was fun and I got things done, but looking back to that, I got very little done with huge effort. I don't think I would have become a programmer at all in that world.

> Fwiw, an 8-core Cortex-A53 like RK3368 or S912 running parallel make can
> build fairly large C projects quite easily.

After several man-months worth of work, our (C++) codebase now compiles and links (for most common configuration) on i7-7900X in about two minutes. If we could cheaply (or at all) drop that by 50 %, it would be noticeable improvement in productivity.

Still, if it would take 10 minutes on some hardware, it could still be said to "build fairly large C++ projects quite easily". That was how things were on before cheap 6+ core CPUs with high single-threaded performance, and our optimizations. However, considering what my employer pays me, it would make no sense at all to tolerate that today.

-JLarja
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TopicPosted ByDate
ARM announces Aresnobody in particular2019/02/20 08:35 AM
  ARM announces AresAdrian2019/02/20 08:39 AM
    ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 10:03 AM
      ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/20 10:41 AM
        ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 12:49 PM
          ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/20 01:21 PM
            ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 02:01 PM
              ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 02:31 PM
                ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 03:16 PM
                  ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 03:49 PM
                    ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 04:09 PM
                      ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 04:45 PM
                        ARM announces Aresnobody in particular2019/02/20 04:55 PM
                          ARM announces AresDan Fay2019/02/20 05:44 PM
                            ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 07:06 PM
                              ARM announces AresDan Fay2019/02/21 08:27 AM
                        ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 05:49 PM
                          ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 06:40 PM
                            ARM announces AresCharles2019/02/21 02:16 AM
                              ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 02:26 AM
                        ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/20 08:55 PM
                          ARM announces AresJS2019/02/21 12:59 AM
                            *has not hasn't (NT)JS2019/02/21 01:01 AM
                            ARM announces AresSalvatore De Dominicis2019/02/21 07:05 AM
                        Definitions of RISCBrendan2019/02/21 10:07 AM
                          Definitions of RISCMichael S2019/02/21 10:16 AM
                          PDP-8 Not Usually Considered RISCMark Roulo2019/02/21 02:10 PM
                            PDP-8 Not Usually Considered RISCrwessel2019/02/21 07:13 PM
                          Definitions of RISCAdrian2019/02/21 02:42 PM
                            Definitions of RISC (nod to John Mashey and comp.arch)wumpus2019/02/21 06:29 PM
                              Definitions of RISC (nod to John Mashey and comp.arch)none2019/02/22 12:32 AM
                                Definitions of RISC (nod to John Mashey and comp.arch)Michael S2019/02/22 04:28 AM
                                  Definitions of RISC (nod to John Mashey and comp.arch)none2019/02/22 08:01 AM
  ARM announces Areslockederboss2019/02/20 09:56 AM
    stability? (NT)anonymous22019/02/20 10:01 AM
    ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 10:05 AM
    ARM announces AresGroo2019/02/20 10:11 AM
    ARM announces AresAndrei Frumusanu2019/02/20 11:49 AM
  ARM announces AresLinus Torvalds2019/02/20 10:36 AM
    ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/20 10:54 AM
    ARM announces AresGeoff Langdale2019/02/20 03:07 PM
      ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 03:32 PM
      ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/21 12:03 AM
        That last line should have been removed :-) (NT)none2019/02/21 12:04 AM
        ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 01:47 AM
          ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/21 03:59 AM
            ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 04:45 AM
            ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/21 05:18 AM
              ARM announces AresSimon Farnsworth2019/02/22 09:43 AM
    ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/20 09:27 PM
      ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 01:53 AM
        ARM announces AresLinus Torvalds2019/02/21 09:03 AM
          ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 09:35 AM
            ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 09:51 AM
            ARM announces AresFoo_2019/02/21 02:40 PM
            ARM announces Aresaaron spink2019/02/21 03:56 PM
            ARM announces AresLinus Torvalds2019/02/21 04:27 PM
              ARM announces AresStoffels2019/02/22 12:21 AM
                ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/22 04:15 AM
                  ARM announces AresSimon Farnsworth2019/02/22 09:41 AM
                    ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/22 10:30 AM
                    In other words: nobody will ever get fired for choosing x86 (NT)Gabriele Svelto2019/02/24 01:32 PM
                      In other words: nobody will ever get fired for choosing x86Simon Farnsworth2019/02/25 04:53 AM
              ARM announces AresFoo_2019/02/22 02:52 AM
              ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/24 01:31 PM
                ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/25 03:57 AM
                  ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/25 04:21 AM
                    ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/25 04:58 AM
                      ARM announces Aresnobody in particular2019/02/25 05:21 AM
                        ARM announces AresAdrian2019/02/26 08:02 AM
                    ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/26 12:32 AM
                      ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/26 12:14 PM
                      ARM announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/19 05:34 PM
                    ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/26 01:34 AM
                      ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/26 12:16 PM
                        ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/27 12:19 AM
              ARM announces Aresend of an era2019/02/24 03:18 PM
                Word salad bot strikes again (NT)nanon2019/02/25 12:26 AM
                ARM announces Areshobel2019/02/25 02:10 AM
                  ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/25 02:52 AM
                    ARM announces Areshobel2019/02/25 10:48 AM
                      ARM announces AresAndrew Clough2019/02/25 02:07 PM
                      ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/26 12:38 AM
                    ARM announces AresJohn Yates2019/02/26 03:43 PM
              ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 06:55 AM
              ARM announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/19 05:22 PM
            ARM announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/19 04:54 PM
              ARMY announces Aresdmcq2019/03/20 03:12 AM
                ARMY announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/20 05:47 AM
                  ARMY announces Aresdmcq2019/03/20 06:05 AM
          ARM announces AresGroo2019/02/21 10:23 AM
            ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 10:29 AM
              ARM announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/19 05:44 PM
            ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/02/21 11:52 AM
            ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/21 08:19 PM
              ARM announces Areshobel2019/02/22 03:40 AM
          software ecosystemsRichardC2019/02/21 04:31 PM
            software ecosystemsFoo_2019/02/22 03:15 AM
          ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/21 05:31 PM
            + on hyperscalingdmcq2019/02/22 08:23 AM
              + on hyperscalingMaynard Handley2019/02/22 08:38 AM
                + on hyperscalingjuanrga2019/02/22 11:57 AM
            + on hyperscalingdmcq2019/02/22 08:23 AM
              sorry duplicatedmcq2019/02/22 08:26 AM
          ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/21 08:34 PM
            ARM announces AresBrett2019/02/21 10:20 PM
          ARM announces AresA. Wilcox2019/02/22 03:52 PM
  ARM announces AresDoug S2019/02/20 03:30 PM
    ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 04:14 PM
      ARM announces AresDoug S2019/02/21 08:40 AM
        ARM announces Aresaaron spink2019/02/21 04:05 PM
        ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/22 08:48 AM
  ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/02/21 02:28 AM
    ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 03:25 AM
      ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/02/22 04:09 AM
      ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/22 08:51 AM
        ARM announces AresDavid Soul2019/02/22 11:47 AM
          ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/02/22 12:23 PM
            Chicken or egg, both.Brett2019/02/22 02:21 PM
              Chicken or egg, both.David Soul2019/02/22 06:05 PM
                Chicken or egg, both.Brett2019/02/22 09:55 PM
                  ARM salesjuanrga2019/02/23 03:55 AM
                    ARM salesaaron spink2019/02/23 08:47 AM
                Chicken or egg, both.Ronald Maas2019/02/23 06:33 PM
                  Chicken or egg, both.Magagop2019/02/24 11:18 PM
                    why not? (NT)Michael S2019/02/25 02:03 AM
                      why not?Not the parent2019/02/25 10:36 AM
                        why not?Michael S2019/02/25 10:43 AM
                          why not?dmcq2019/02/25 11:35 AM
                            why not?Michael S2019/02/25 12:03 PM
                              why not?dmcq2019/02/25 12:29 PM
                              why not?Not the parent2019/02/26 10:08 AM
                                why not?Doug S2019/02/26 12:05 PM
                                  why not?Not the parent2019/02/27 04:51 AM
                                    why not?Doug S2019/02/27 12:15 PM
                                      why not?Not the parent2019/02/28 01:43 AM
                                why not?anon2019/02/26 11:22 PM
                                  why not?Not the parent2019/02/27 04:59 AM
                                    why not?anon2019/02/27 06:42 AM
                                      why not?Magagop2019/02/27 03:31 PM
                                        why not?anon2019/02/27 05:02 PM
                                          why not?dmcq2019/02/27 05:25 PM
                                            why not?anon2019/02/27 05:56 PM
                                              why not?dmcq2019/02/27 06:19 PM
                                                why not?anon2019/02/27 06:46 PM
                                                  why not?Wilco2019/02/28 05:49 AM
                                                    why not?Jukka Larja2019/02/28 07:02 AM
                                                      why not?Michael S2019/02/28 08:32 AM
                                                      why not?Wilco2019/02/28 09:40 AM
                                                      why not?Doug S2019/02/28 10:13 AM
                                                        why not?Foo_2019/03/01 07:35 AM
                                                          why not?Doug S2019/03/01 11:05 AM
                                                            why not?anon2019/03/01 02:32 PM
                                                              why not?dmcq2019/03/01 03:13 PM
                                                                why not?anon2019/03/01 04:13 PM
                                                                  why not?dmcq2019/03/02 03:56 AM
                                                                    why not?anon2019/03/02 10:09 AM
                                                                      why not?dmcq2019/03/02 10:41 AM
                                                                        why not?anon2019/03/02 12:19 PM
                                                                          why not?dmcq2019/03/03 03:48 AM
                                                                      why not?Doug S2019/03/02 04:53 PM
                                                                        why not?Michael S2019/03/02 05:06 PM
                                                                          why not?Doug S2019/03/03 12:54 AM
                                                                            why not?Michael S2019/03/03 02:58 AM
                                                                              why not?anon2019/03/03 05:35 AM
                                                                                why not?dmcq2019/03/03 06:33 AM
                                                                                  I considired dry humor a Brittish specialty. It seems, I was wrong about it. (NT)Michael S2019/03/03 06:39 AM
                                                                                  why not?anon2019/03/03 10:13 AM
                                                                                    why not?Michael S2019/03/03 12:41 PM
                                                                                      why not?dmcq2019/03/03 01:21 PM
                                                                                        why not?anon2019/03/03 04:15 PM
                                                    why not?anon2019/02/28 08:38 PM
                                              why not?Not the parent2019/02/28 01:48 AM
                                                strawman (NT)anon2019/02/28 08:31 PM
                            why not?Michael S2019/02/27 03:53 AM
                              why not?Not the parent2019/02/27 05:26 AM
                                why not?Michael S2019/02/27 05:42 AM
                              why not?dmcq2019/02/27 05:49 AM
                                why not?Michael S2019/02/27 06:21 AM
                                  why not?dmcq2019/02/27 07:15 AM
                                Selling at multiple layersPaul A. Clayton2019/02/27 11:25 AM
                                  Selling at multiple layersDoug S2019/02/27 12:45 PM
                                    Selling at multiple layersPaul A. Clayton2019/02/27 02:32 PM
                                      Selling at multiple layersDoug S2019/02/27 04:04 PM
                                        Paul A. Clayton2019/02/27 07:06 PM
                                          Arm reference board?Simon Farnsworth2019/02/28 12:34 PM
                                why not?Doug S2019/02/27 12:46 PM
                      why not? (NT)la mama de murgay2019/02/25 10:22 PM
                    Chicken or egg, both.Ronald Maas2019/02/25 01:23 PM
            ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/24 03:07 PM
              ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/03/02 05:40 AM
                ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/03/02 08:08 AM
                  ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/03/02 10:10 AM
          ARM announces Areshobel2019/02/22 04:33 PM
            ARM announces AresDavid Soul2019/02/22 06:20 PM
              TrollDoug S2019/02/23 01:37 AM
                TrollDavid Soul2019/02/23 08:59 AM
              ARM announces AresEnnis2019/02/23 02:18 AM
                ARM announces AresFoo_2019/02/23 02:38 AM
                  ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/23 03:46 AM
                ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/23 05:41 AM
  ARM announces Aresnobody in particular2019/02/26 03:58 AM
    expensiveanonymous22019/02/27 12:46 AM
    ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 07:19 AM
      ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 07:21 AM
        ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/27 07:57 AM
        ARM announces AresJukka Larja2019/02/27 08:11 AM
          ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/27 08:16 AM
            ARM announces AresDoug S2019/02/27 12:49 PM
              ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/27 01:43 PM
                ARM announces AresDoug S2019/02/27 04:06 PM
                  ARM announces AresGian-Carlo Pascutto2019/02/28 05:00 AM
                ARM announces AresGian-Carlo Pascutto2019/02/28 05:02 AM
                  ARM announces AresMichael S2019/03/01 03:47 AM
                    death by a thousand cutsMichael S2019/03/01 07:27 AM
                      death by a thousand cutsFoo_2019/03/01 07:37 AM
                        death by a thousand cutsdmcq2019/03/01 12:10 PM
              ARM announces AresJukka Larja2019/02/28 06:31 AM
                ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/28 09:17 AM
                  ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/28 03:02 PM
                    ARM announces Aresaaron spink2019/03/01 01:19 AM
                ARM announces AresAndrew Clough2019/02/28 11:32 AM
                  ARM announces AresAndrew Clough2019/02/28 11:33 AM
                  ARM announces AresFoo_2019/03/01 01:55 AM
                  ARM announces AresJukka Larja2019/03/01 05:40 AM
          ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 08:45 AM
            ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/27 09:17 AM
              ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/27 09:21 AM
                ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 04:03 PM
            ARM announces AresJukka Larja2019/02/28 06:03 AM
      ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/27 11:49 PM
        ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/28 04:26 AM
          ARM announces AresPeter E. Fry2019/02/28 07:31 PM
            ARM announces AresAdrian2019/02/28 10:09 PM
            ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/03/02 12:56 AM
              ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/03/02 10:05 AM
                ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/03/02 02:31 PM
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