ARM announces Ares

By: Howard Chu (hyc.delete@this.symas.com), February 28, 2019 9:17 am
Room: Moderated Discussions
Jukka Larja (roskakori2006.delete@this.gmail.com) on February 28, 2019 5:31 am wrote:
> Doug S (foo.delete@this.bar.bar) on February 27, 2019 11:49 am wrote:
> > Michael S (already5chosen.delete@this.yahoo.com) on February 27, 2019 7:16 am wrote:
> > > Jukka Larja (roskakori2006.delete@this.gmail.com) on February 27, 2019 7:11 am wrote:
> > > > Howard Chu (hyc.delete@this.symas.com) on February 27, 2019 6:21 am wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Note - 2GB is actually plenty to be productive in C. It's not enough
> > > > > for parallel compiles of C++ unfortunately. IMO this is the fault of C++,
> > > > > not of the ARM boxes.
> > > >
> > > > Unfortunately 2 GB isn't enough for the browser I need to run
> > > > to be able to write anything non-trivial with any language.
> > > >
> > > > (Not that I would be in the market for an ARM box even if they were a bit faster than
> > > > x86 ones. However, I find it absurd that 2 GBs is considered "plenty" for any use.)
> > > >
> > > > -JLarja
> > >
> > > Any amount of memory isn't enough for the browser.
> > > At least for the browser I use most (FF, x86-64, Windows).
> > >
> >
> >
> > I don't understand why Firefox continues to have memory issues on Windows when they
> > seem to have fixed them on Linux. I've had my Firefox browser running since January
> > 3rd with about 30 windows and almost 80 tabs total, and it has an RSS of 1.4 GB.
>
> I don't know what RSS would correspond to in Windows speak, but 1.4 GB doesn't sound
> good if 2 GB is all you have and you need to run some other software too.
>
> I can't really tell what my Firefox is using, since it's made up from nine processes.
> Seven of those have private bytes in range from 300-650 MBs. Two are smaller. I'm
> also running Chrome which is made up of 31 considerable smaller processes.
>
> An instant messenger wrapper Franz that I use for e.g. WhatsApp and Telegram, is made up of 12
> processes which have total private bytes amount close to Firefox. I'm not saying that makes any
> sense, but that's the world we are living in. I choose to solve the problem with 32 GBs of memory
> in a laptop. Someone else might choose to use Bitlbee/whapp-irc/Teleirc and Irssi.
>
> > A few years ago I had to restart weekly because it would get up to about 5 GB (with fewer windows/tabs
> > since I had to be more careful) and I only had 8 GB installed in my PC at that time...
>
> I haven't had any problems with Firefox leaking memory for few years now and since 64 bit
> version hit mainstream, I haven't had any out of memory problems either. I usually restart
> Firefox when it offers to update or when Windows does. That said, I just retired my last
> computer with just 16 GBs of memory and haven't seriously used a browser on anything with
> less than that for years, so even if Firefox' working set was 4 GB, I wouldn't notice.
>
> If I was just keeping one or few pages open, the average memory consumption
> would probably be pretty reasonable. The problem is that it doesn't take more
> than one or two sites with bad behaviour and things get unreasonable soon.

I find that the RSS still grows and also the number of threads grows. Browser performance overall slows down over time, most likely due to heap fragmentation, but I'd really like to know why it's spawning more threads over time. My current laptop has 32GB of RAM but even that starts to slow down after a few days of continual use; exiting and restarting the browser makes things tolerable again for a few more days. The overall behavior, continual memory growth and accumulation of threads (which tend to be idle whenever I've looked) indicates a broken design somewhere.

This is the world we're living in but we didn't become software/hardware engineers to accept the world as it is. We're here to change it - presumably for the better. Unfortunately the Mozilla codebase is so huge and unwieldy it's hard to identify where any individual problem may be. It strikes me that the entirety of the codebase is "the problem." (And I was actively developing on this code base a decade or so ago...)
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TopicPosted ByDate
ARM announces Aresnobody in particular2019/02/20 08:35 AM
  ARM announces AresAdrian2019/02/20 08:39 AM
    ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 10:03 AM
      ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/20 10:41 AM
        ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 12:49 PM
          ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/20 01:21 PM
            ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 02:01 PM
              ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 02:31 PM
                ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 03:16 PM
                  ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 03:49 PM
                    ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 04:09 PM
                      ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 04:45 PM
                        ARM announces Aresnobody in particular2019/02/20 04:55 PM
                          ARM announces AresDan Fay2019/02/20 05:44 PM
                            ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 07:06 PM
                              ARM announces AresDan Fay2019/02/21 08:27 AM
                        ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 05:49 PM
                          ARM announces AresWilco2019/02/20 06:40 PM
                            ARM announces AresCharles2019/02/21 02:16 AM
                              ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 02:26 AM
                        ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/20 08:55 PM
                          ARM announces AresJS2019/02/21 12:59 AM
                            *has not hasn't (NT)JS2019/02/21 01:01 AM
                            ARM announces AresSalvatore De Dominicis2019/02/21 07:05 AM
                        Definitions of RISCBrendan2019/02/21 10:07 AM
                          Definitions of RISCMichael S2019/02/21 10:16 AM
                          PDP-8 Not Usually Considered RISCMark Roulo2019/02/21 02:10 PM
                            PDP-8 Not Usually Considered RISCrwessel2019/02/21 07:13 PM
                          Definitions of RISCAdrian2019/02/21 02:42 PM
                            Definitions of RISC (nod to John Mashey and comp.arch)wumpus2019/02/21 06:29 PM
                              Definitions of RISC (nod to John Mashey and comp.arch)none2019/02/22 12:32 AM
                                Definitions of RISC (nod to John Mashey and comp.arch)Michael S2019/02/22 04:28 AM
                                  Definitions of RISC (nod to John Mashey and comp.arch)none2019/02/22 08:01 AM
  ARM announces Areslockederboss2019/02/20 09:56 AM
    stability? (NT)anonymous22019/02/20 10:01 AM
    ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 10:05 AM
    ARM announces AresGroo2019/02/20 10:11 AM
    ARM announces AresAndrei Frumusanu2019/02/20 11:49 AM
  ARM announces AresLinus Torvalds2019/02/20 10:36 AM
    ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/20 10:54 AM
    ARM announces AresGeoff Langdale2019/02/20 03:07 PM
      ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 03:32 PM
      ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/21 12:03 AM
        That last line should have been removed :-) (NT)none2019/02/21 12:04 AM
        ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 01:47 AM
          ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/21 03:59 AM
            ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 04:45 AM
            ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/21 05:18 AM
              ARM announces AresSimon Farnsworth2019/02/22 09:43 AM
    ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/20 09:27 PM
      ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 01:53 AM
        ARM announces AresLinus Torvalds2019/02/21 09:03 AM
          ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 09:35 AM
            ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 09:51 AM
            ARM announces AresFoo_2019/02/21 02:40 PM
            ARM announces Aresaaron spink2019/02/21 03:56 PM
            ARM announces AresLinus Torvalds2019/02/21 04:27 PM
              ARM announces AresStoffels2019/02/22 12:21 AM
                ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/22 04:15 AM
                  ARM announces AresSimon Farnsworth2019/02/22 09:41 AM
                    ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/22 10:30 AM
                    In other words: nobody will ever get fired for choosing x86 (NT)Gabriele Svelto2019/02/24 01:32 PM
                      In other words: nobody will ever get fired for choosing x86Simon Farnsworth2019/02/25 04:53 AM
              ARM announces AresFoo_2019/02/22 02:52 AM
              ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/24 01:31 PM
                ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/25 03:57 AM
                  ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/25 04:21 AM
                    ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/25 04:58 AM
                      ARM announces Aresnobody in particular2019/02/25 05:21 AM
                        ARM announces AresAdrian2019/02/26 08:02 AM
                    ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/26 12:32 AM
                      ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/26 12:14 PM
                      ARM announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/19 05:34 PM
                    ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/26 01:34 AM
                      ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/26 12:16 PM
                        ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/27 12:19 AM
              ARM announces Aresend of an era2019/02/24 03:18 PM
                Word salad bot strikes again (NT)nanon2019/02/25 12:26 AM
                ARM announces Areshobel2019/02/25 02:10 AM
                  ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/25 02:52 AM
                    ARM announces Areshobel2019/02/25 10:48 AM
                      ARM announces AresAndrew Clough2019/02/25 02:07 PM
                      ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/26 12:38 AM
                    ARM announces AresJohn Yates2019/02/26 03:43 PM
              ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 06:55 AM
              ARM announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/19 05:22 PM
            ARM announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/19 04:54 PM
              ARMY announces Aresdmcq2019/03/20 03:12 AM
                ARMY announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/20 05:47 AM
                  ARMY announces Aresdmcq2019/03/20 06:05 AM
          ARM announces AresGroo2019/02/21 10:23 AM
            ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 10:29 AM
              ARM announces AresDavid Hess2019/03/19 05:44 PM
            ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/02/21 11:52 AM
            ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/21 08:19 PM
              ARM announces Areshobel2019/02/22 03:40 AM
          software ecosystemsRichardC2019/02/21 04:31 PM
            software ecosystemsFoo_2019/02/22 03:15 AM
          ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/21 05:31 PM
            + on hyperscalingdmcq2019/02/22 08:23 AM
              + on hyperscalingMaynard Handley2019/02/22 08:38 AM
                + on hyperscalingjuanrga2019/02/22 11:57 AM
            + on hyperscalingdmcq2019/02/22 08:23 AM
              sorry duplicatedmcq2019/02/22 08:26 AM
          ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/21 08:34 PM
            ARM announces AresBrett2019/02/21 10:20 PM
          ARM announces AresA. Wilcox2019/02/22 03:52 PM
  ARM announces AresDoug S2019/02/20 03:30 PM
    ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/20 04:14 PM
      ARM announces AresDoug S2019/02/21 08:40 AM
        ARM announces Aresaaron spink2019/02/21 04:05 PM
        ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/22 08:48 AM
  ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/02/21 02:28 AM
    ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/21 03:25 AM
      ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/02/22 04:09 AM
      ARM announces AresMaynard Handley2019/02/22 08:51 AM
        ARM announces AresDavid Soul2019/02/22 11:47 AM
          ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/02/22 12:23 PM
            Chicken or egg, both.Brett2019/02/22 02:21 PM
              Chicken or egg, both.David Soul2019/02/22 06:05 PM
                Chicken or egg, both.Brett2019/02/22 09:55 PM
                  ARM salesjuanrga2019/02/23 03:55 AM
                    ARM salesaaron spink2019/02/23 08:47 AM
                Chicken or egg, both.Ronald Maas2019/02/23 06:33 PM
                  Chicken or egg, both.Magagop2019/02/24 11:18 PM
                    why not? (NT)Michael S2019/02/25 02:03 AM
                      why not?Not the parent2019/02/25 10:36 AM
                        why not?Michael S2019/02/25 10:43 AM
                          why not?dmcq2019/02/25 11:35 AM
                            why not?Michael S2019/02/25 12:03 PM
                              why not?dmcq2019/02/25 12:29 PM
                              why not?Not the parent2019/02/26 10:08 AM
                                why not?Doug S2019/02/26 12:05 PM
                                  why not?Not the parent2019/02/27 04:51 AM
                                    why not?Doug S2019/02/27 12:15 PM
                                      why not?Not the parent2019/02/28 01:43 AM
                                why not?anon2019/02/26 11:22 PM
                                  why not?Not the parent2019/02/27 04:59 AM
                                    why not?anon2019/02/27 06:42 AM
                                      why not?Magagop2019/02/27 03:31 PM
                                        why not?anon2019/02/27 05:02 PM
                                          why not?dmcq2019/02/27 05:25 PM
                                            why not?anon2019/02/27 05:56 PM
                                              why not?dmcq2019/02/27 06:19 PM
                                                why not?anon2019/02/27 06:46 PM
                                                  why not?Wilco2019/02/28 05:49 AM
                                                    why not?Jukka Larja2019/02/28 07:02 AM
                                                      why not?Michael S2019/02/28 08:32 AM
                                                      why not?Wilco2019/02/28 09:40 AM
                                                      why not?Doug S2019/02/28 10:13 AM
                                                        why not?Foo_2019/03/01 07:35 AM
                                                          why not?Doug S2019/03/01 11:05 AM
                                                            why not?anon2019/03/01 02:32 PM
                                                              why not?dmcq2019/03/01 03:13 PM
                                                                why not?anon2019/03/01 04:13 PM
                                                                  why not?dmcq2019/03/02 03:56 AM
                                                                    why not?anon2019/03/02 10:09 AM
                                                                      why not?dmcq2019/03/02 10:41 AM
                                                                        why not?anon2019/03/02 12:19 PM
                                                                          why not?dmcq2019/03/03 03:48 AM
                                                                      why not?Doug S2019/03/02 04:53 PM
                                                                        why not?Michael S2019/03/02 05:06 PM
                                                                          why not?Doug S2019/03/03 12:54 AM
                                                                            why not?Michael S2019/03/03 02:58 AM
                                                                              why not?anon2019/03/03 05:35 AM
                                                                                why not?dmcq2019/03/03 06:33 AM
                                                                                  I considired dry humor a Brittish specialty. It seems, I was wrong about it. (NT)Michael S2019/03/03 06:39 AM
                                                                                  why not?anon2019/03/03 10:13 AM
                                                                                    why not?Michael S2019/03/03 12:41 PM
                                                                                      why not?dmcq2019/03/03 01:21 PM
                                                                                        why not?anon2019/03/03 04:15 PM
                                                    why not?anon2019/02/28 08:38 PM
                                              why not?Not the parent2019/02/28 01:48 AM
                                                strawman (NT)anon2019/02/28 08:31 PM
                            why not?Michael S2019/02/27 03:53 AM
                              why not?Not the parent2019/02/27 05:26 AM
                                why not?Michael S2019/02/27 05:42 AM
                              why not?dmcq2019/02/27 05:49 AM
                                why not?Michael S2019/02/27 06:21 AM
                                  why not?dmcq2019/02/27 07:15 AM
                                Selling at multiple layersPaul A. Clayton2019/02/27 11:25 AM
                                  Selling at multiple layersDoug S2019/02/27 12:45 PM
                                    Selling at multiple layersPaul A. Clayton2019/02/27 02:32 PM
                                      Selling at multiple layersDoug S2019/02/27 04:04 PM
                                        Paul A. Clayton2019/02/27 07:06 PM
                                          Arm reference board?Simon Farnsworth2019/02/28 12:34 PM
                                why not?Doug S2019/02/27 12:46 PM
                      why not? (NT)la mama de murgay2019/02/25 10:22 PM
                    Chicken or egg, both.Ronald Maas2019/02/25 01:23 PM
            ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/24 03:07 PM
              ARM announces Aresjuanrga2019/03/02 05:40 AM
                ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/03/02 08:08 AM
                  ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/03/02 10:10 AM
          ARM announces Areshobel2019/02/22 04:33 PM
            ARM announces AresDavid Soul2019/02/22 06:20 PM
              TrollDoug S2019/02/23 01:37 AM
                TrollDavid Soul2019/02/23 08:59 AM
              ARM announces AresEnnis2019/02/23 02:18 AM
                ARM announces AresFoo_2019/02/23 02:38 AM
                  ARM announces Aresanon2019/02/23 03:46 AM
                ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/23 05:41 AM
  ARM announces Aresnobody in particular2019/02/26 03:58 AM
    expensiveanonymous22019/02/27 12:46 AM
    ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 07:19 AM
      ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 07:21 AM
        ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/27 07:57 AM
        ARM announces AresJukka Larja2019/02/27 08:11 AM
          ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/27 08:16 AM
            ARM announces AresDoug S2019/02/27 12:49 PM
              ARM announces AresMichael S2019/02/27 01:43 PM
                ARM announces AresDoug S2019/02/27 04:06 PM
                  ARM announces AresGian-Carlo Pascutto2019/02/28 05:00 AM
                ARM announces AresGian-Carlo Pascutto2019/02/28 05:02 AM
                  ARM announces AresMichael S2019/03/01 03:47 AM
                    death by a thousand cutsMichael S2019/03/01 07:27 AM
                      death by a thousand cutsFoo_2019/03/01 07:37 AM
                        death by a thousand cutsdmcq2019/03/01 12:10 PM
              ARM announces AresJukka Larja2019/02/28 06:31 AM
                ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/28 09:17 AM
                  ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/02/28 03:02 PM
                    ARM announces Aresaaron spink2019/03/01 01:19 AM
                ARM announces AresAndrew Clough2019/02/28 11:32 AM
                  ARM announces AresAndrew Clough2019/02/28 11:33 AM
                  ARM announces AresFoo_2019/03/01 01:55 AM
                  ARM announces AresJukka Larja2019/03/01 05:40 AM
          ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 08:45 AM
            ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/27 09:17 AM
              ARM announces Aresdmcq2019/02/27 09:21 AM
                ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/27 04:03 PM
            ARM announces AresJukka Larja2019/02/28 06:03 AM
      ARM announces Aresnone2019/02/27 11:49 PM
        ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/02/28 04:26 AM
          ARM announces AresPeter E. Fry2019/02/28 07:31 PM
            ARM announces AresAdrian2019/02/28 10:09 PM
            ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/03/02 12:56 AM
              ARM announces AresHoward Chu2019/03/02 10:05 AM
                ARM announces AresGabriele Svelto2019/03/02 02:31 PM
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