Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chips

By: Simon Farnsworth (simon.delete@this.farnz.org.uk), May 7, 2019 4:23 am
Room: Moderated Discussions
Doug S (foo.delete@this.bar.bar) on May 3, 2019 1:11 am wrote:
> Maynard Handley (name99.delete@this.name99.org) on May 2, 2019 3:58 pm wrote:
> > I think it's possible the numbers could work out IF you allow
> > for the vastly different ambitions/goals of Apple
> > vs Intel or QC. Especially if Apple continue to offload some
> > of the parts of the RF front-end (as they do today)
> > to companies like Avago and Skyworks, only planning to move onto that sort of hardware later (if ever)?
>
>
> I keep saying and people keep doubting that Apple simply will ignore 2G/3G and make an LTE/5G only
> modem. The longer it takes them to get it out the door the more likely/feasible that strategy becomes.
> That's going to reduce their complexity of their design and software since it gets rid of so much
> legacy stuff, and everything is packet switched so they don't have to even deal with circuit switched
> legacy voice/SMS. That has to reduce the number of engineers they'd need.
>
> Yes, I'm aware of the objections people have that 3G networks in Europe and some other parts of
> the world won't be shut down for many years, unlike the situation here in the US where major carriers
> will have them all gone within a couple years (before any possible date of introduction of an Apple
> designed modem) but they are keeping them around as a legacy to support IoT devices like cellular
> alarms and what not and not to my knowledge intending them for widespread usage by mobile phone
> customers. Unless there is a lot of area that simply isn't covered by LTE/5G at all but only by
> 3G, there wouldn't be any reason for Apple to support anything older than LTE.
>

It's not just about lack of coverage; it's about the corner cases that will continue to exist until 2G and 3G are turned off completely. For example, in many countries, there is no deployment of national emergency roaming for IMS-based voice services; if you want to make a 112 call while outside your home network's coverage area (but in coverage of another network), then you need to be able to access 2G or 3G CS calling.

This sort of corner case is going to exist for a long time, because there is no commercial driver to fix it, nor is there reason for the state to intervene (as it did to set up emergency roaming to begin with) until the networks start to discuss switching off CS calling. However, it is the sort of case that leads to radically nasty headlines - imagine "child dies because parents bought iPhones" sort of situations.

If Apple do omit 2G/3G support from their own modem, then I would expect it to be either Watch and iPad only for a while, or used with a licenced 2G/3G block that's power-gated based on the availability of 4G/5G networks for the built-in modem. After all, it doesn't need to be great for this sort of purpose - adequate 2G/3G data for roaming to odd destinations that don't have LTE roaming yet, and CS calling for cases where national regulations haven't caught up with PS calling yet.

This is also where the rumours that Apple would buy Intel's modem division made a lot of sense - Intel has a working 2G/3G solution, and Apple don't need a great 2G/3G solution, just one that works well enough to fill in all the corner cases for the next 20 years. Heck, if TI still have the modem stack for their OMAP chips, they could license that to Apple for 2G/3G; again, this doesn't need to be great, just good enough to call an Uber if your network has no LTE roaming in your visited country, and to make a 112 call if your network is unavailable.

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TopicPosted ByDate
Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDummond D. Slow2019/04/18 03:47 PM
  antitrust implications? (NT)anonymous22019/04/18 07:53 PM
    antitrust implications?Doug S2019/04/18 08:50 PM
      antitrust implications?Beastian2019/04/18 10:02 PM
  Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDoug S2019/04/18 08:45 PM
    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsdmcq2019/04/18 10:05 PM
      Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/18 10:28 PM
        Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsAdrian2019/04/18 11:48 PM
          Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsdmcq2019/04/19 05:54 AM
            Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsAdrian2019/04/19 09:33 AM
              Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsdmcq2019/04/19 10:54 AM
            Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/19 11:03 AM
          Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/19 07:38 AM
            Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipssylt2019/04/19 09:28 AM
              Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/19 10:03 AM
                Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipssylt2019/04/19 11:08 PM
                  Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/20 09:15 AM
                    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/20 09:41 AM
                    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipssylt2019/04/20 01:22 PM
                      Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/20 07:31 PM
                        Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/20 09:41 PM
                      Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsGroo2019/04/21 06:50 AM
            Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsAdrian2019/04/19 09:45 AM
              Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/19 10:27 AM
                Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/19 11:09 AM
                  Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/19 11:17 AM
                    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/19 12:19 PM
                      Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsGroo2019/04/20 05:50 AM
                        Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/20 09:49 AM
                          Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/20 10:08 AM
                            Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/20 11:18 PM
                              Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/20 11:19 PM
        Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDoug S2019/04/19 09:46 AM
          Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/19 10:50 AM
          Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/19 03:17 PM
            Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDoug S2019/04/19 09:59 PM
              Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsGroo2019/04/20 08:28 AM
              Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/20 09:33 AM
                Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/20 11:26 PM
            Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/20 09:55 AM
      Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsAndreas2019/04/19 03:55 AM
    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsAndrew Clough2019/04/19 05:19 AM
    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsGroo2019/04/19 06:44 AM
    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/19 10:49 AM
    Read this and realize what Apple doesGroo2019/04/19 03:27 PM
  Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/19 10:32 AM
    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDummond D. Slow2019/04/19 11:15 AM
    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDoug S2019/04/19 01:48 PM
      Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/19 02:53 PM
        Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDoug S2019/04/19 10:05 PM
          Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/20 09:49 AM
            Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDoug S2019/04/20 11:07 PM
              Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/05/15 06:51 AM
                Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDoug S2019/05/15 10:16 AM
                Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/05/15 11:21 AM
  Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDummond D. Slow2019/04/25 10:37 AM
    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/25 11:43 AM
      Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsdmcq2019/04/26 01:22 AM
        Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/04/26 09:05 AM
          Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/26 10:57 AM
            Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsAnon2019/04/27 03:11 PM
              Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/04/27 07:15 PM
                Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDoug S2019/04/28 05:59 AM
                  Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/05/02 11:01 AM
                    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/05/02 02:58 PM
                      Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/05/02 03:27 PM
                      Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsanonymou52019/05/02 04:37 PM
                        Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDummond D. Slow2019/05/03 12:35 AM
                          Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/05/03 08:32 AM
                            Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDummond D. Slow2019/05/03 12:32 PM
                              Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/05/03 02:45 PM
                                Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsUmmmm...2019/05/03 03:35 PM
                                  Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/05/03 03:56 PM
                                  Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDummond D. Slow2019/05/03 08:10 PM
                                    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDummond D. Slow2019/05/03 08:11 PM
                                    Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/05/03 09:12 PM
                                      Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDummond D. Slow2019/05/04 07:33 AM
                      Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDoug S2019/05/03 12:11 AM
                        Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/05/06 08:09 AM
                          Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/05/06 10:40 AM
                            Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsBeastian2019/05/06 12:16 PM
                              Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsMaynard Handley2019/05/06 03:15 PM
                        Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsSimon Farnsworth2019/05/07 04:23 AM
          Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsdmcq2019/04/26 11:52 AM
  Apple agrees to become Qualcomm's licensee and returns to their baseband chipsDummond D. Slow2019/05/02 08:25 AM
    So Qualcomm got less than 2/3 of what they wantedDoug S2019/05/02 09:35 AM
      So Qualcomm got less than 2/3 of what they wantedBeastian2019/05/02 10:43 AM
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