By: nobody in particular (nobody.delete@this.nowhe.re), June 22, 2020 5:55 pm
Room: Moderated Discussions
pgerassi (pgerassi2012.delete@this.wi.rr.com) on June 22, 2020 5:29 pm wrote:
> Chester (lamchester.delete@this.gmail.com) on June 22, 2020 1:32 pm wrote:
> > Maynard Handley (name99.delete@this.name99.org) on June 22, 2020 11:44 am wrote:
> > > Maynard Handley (name99.delete@this.name99.org) on June 22, 2020 11:26 am wrote:
> > > > It's real!!!!
> > >
> > > Well we saw something of how x86 apps will work.
> > > Any comments from the various people making strong claims regarding this?
> > > Of particular interest was (img)
> >
> > We haven't seen much in terms of CPU performance. Several comments:
>
> I looked into Apple GPU performance. What they don't tell people is that their GPU renders using 16 bit
> integers versus AMD/NV/Intel which use 32 bit floating point. That is much easier for their GPU. Its
> like comparing ping pong balls versus basketballs. Manipulating the latter is a lot more work. And that
> is how they look more efficient or faster on these lightweight benchmarks on iPads/phones and such.
>
> When they have to do rendering for games without losing fidelity, they are much slower. Their
> top end A12Z iGPU in an iPad get 27FPS on a 1080p AAA Game like Tomb Raider while a 6CU GCN 2700U
> APU gets 52FPS. This comparison using Geekbench graphics says the A12Z has 1.8 times the 2700U
> score. And of course there is the "we do better against a 2 year old part with our brand new
> part" problem. A14 will need to compete with Ryzen 5xxxU APUs and not Ryzen 2700U APUs.
>
> So lets wait for the 3rd party benchmarks doing real work or a facsimile thereof.
>
> Pete
>
> > I think they're trying to show graphics acceleration works properly on the
> > A12Z and Rosetta 2 is functional. There was no attempt to show A12Z being competitive
> > with desktop Intel/AMD chips - even ones from a few years ago.
> >
> > IMO we have to wait a couple years for Apple to release a desktop ARM chip before drawing
> > conclusions (or at least for the A12Z dev kit to get out into the wild). They said the transition
> > would last that long. And I hope they do well, because that'll light a fire under Intel and
> > AMD. The next few years should be very interesting for CPU microarchitecture.
>
>
Tomb Raider doesn't run on the iPad.
> Chester (lamchester.delete@this.gmail.com) on June 22, 2020 1:32 pm wrote:
> > Maynard Handley (name99.delete@this.name99.org) on June 22, 2020 11:44 am wrote:
> > > Maynard Handley (name99.delete@this.name99.org) on June 22, 2020 11:26 am wrote:
> > > > It's real!!!!
> > >
> > > Well we saw something of how x86 apps will work.
> > > Any comments from the various people making strong claims regarding this?
> > > Of particular interest was (img)
> >
> > We haven't seen much in terms of CPU performance. Several comments:
- Showing off Word/Excel/Powerpoint is strange. Those apps run fine on an underclocked Atom
- DNG files in Lightroom - weird they didn't show exporting/raw conversion. Getting
> > low res previews of effects was very fast on 2013-era mobile Haswell. Maybe they didn't
> > show export because FPU performance is one of Intel's strengths (2x256-bit AVX execution
> > units), and processing high res images really takes advantage of that. - Maya - I don't have Maya, but Blender's workspace view is a very light GPU load. I suspect it's the
> > same for Maya. If they were confident in CPU performance, they'd show a CPU render. They did not. - Playback of multiple 4K streams - just means their GPU has a
> > modern video engine. Intel's iGPUs could do this years ago - Tomb Raider - they ran through a small, isolated area without any enemies/allies
> > present. I expect the weakest CPUs to have no trouble with that.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> I looked into Apple GPU performance. What they don't tell people is that their GPU renders using 16 bit
> integers versus AMD/NV/Intel which use 32 bit floating point. That is much easier for their GPU. Its
> like comparing ping pong balls versus basketballs. Manipulating the latter is a lot more work. And that
> is how they look more efficient or faster on these lightweight benchmarks on iPads/phones and such.
>
> When they have to do rendering for games without losing fidelity, they are much slower. Their
> top end A12Z iGPU in an iPad get 27FPS on a 1080p AAA Game like Tomb Raider while a 6CU GCN 2700U
> APU gets 52FPS. This comparison using Geekbench graphics says the A12Z has 1.8 times the 2700U
> score. And of course there is the "we do better against a 2 year old part with our brand new
> part" problem. A14 will need to compete with Ryzen 5xxxU APUs and not Ryzen 2700U APUs.
>
> So lets wait for the 3rd party benchmarks doing real work or a facsimile thereof.
>
> Pete
>
> > I think they're trying to show graphics acceleration works properly on the
> > A12Z and Rosetta 2 is functional. There was no attempt to show A12Z being competitive
> > with desktop Intel/AMD chips - even ones from a few years ago.
> >
> > IMO we have to wait a couple years for Apple to release a desktop ARM chip before drawing
> > conclusions (or at least for the A12Z dev kit to get out into the wild). They said the transition
> > would last that long. And I hope they do well, because that'll light a fire under Intel and
> > AMD. The next few years should be very interesting for CPU microarchitecture.
>
>
Tomb Raider doesn't run on the iPad.
