Ryzen 9 5000 series processor vs. M1

By: Dummond D. Slow (mental.delete@this.protozoa.us), January 4, 2021 1:11 pm
Room: Moderated Discussions
Adrian (a.delete@this.acm.org) on January 2, 2021 2:00 pm wrote:
> Dummond D. Slow (mental.delete@this.protozoa.us) on January 2, 2021 12:50 pm wrote:
> > Adrian (a.delete@this.acm.org) on January 2, 2021 2:45 am wrote:
> > > Adrian (a.delete@this.acm.org) on January 1, 2021 1:28 pm wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Now I have just replaced the 3700X with a 5900X, and ECC
> > > > seems to work OK starting with the Linux kernel 5.10.
> > > >
> > > > However, I have not repeated yet the memory overclocking test with the new CPU, to see if the
> > > > errors are really reported, but I intend to do it again when I will have some spare time.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I think that it is interesting to mention that after finally having direct access
> > > to a Zen 3 CPU, I have verified that is faster in single-thread than Apple M1.
> > >
> > > The Apple M1 was advantaged at launch, because the available benchmarks that could be compared with it
> > > at that time were done poorly on Tiger Lake and Zen 3, making Apple M1 to appear better than it is.
> > >
> > > For example, Tiger Lake @ 4.8 GHz should reach a Geekbench 5 single-thread score
> > > of around 1750, exactly the same as Apple M1 @ 3.2 GHz (up to 1752, many close to
> > > 1750), if we extrapolate from the good scores recorded for Tiger Lake @ 4.7 GHz.
> > >
> > > However all the i7-1185G7 scores from the GB5 database are
> > > much lower, lower than the good scores of the slower
> > > i7-1165G7, so I believe that all the few existing laptop models that have i7-1185G7 suck badly and we will
> > > see the actual speed of Tiger Lake @ 4.8 GHz only when the
> > > Intel NUC with it will be available, in a few months
> > > (even Intel is expected to launch first an Intel NUC with i7-1165G7, unlike in the past when they used only
> > > the top speed for themselves; so they must still have serious yield problems with the top SKU).
> > >
> > >
> > > So for Intel Tiger Lake there is no direct proof yet, about how exactly it is positioned against Apple M1.
> > >
> > > On the other hand, at the Apple M1 launch there were only poor benchmarks
> > > done on Zen 3, so it seemed slower in single-thread than M1.
> > >
> > > Meanwhile many better benchmarks have accumulated for Zen 3 (a lot of GB5 ST
> > > scores over 1800 at the nominal clock frequencies) and I now have my own sample,
> > > so I could verify that the high Zen 3 scores are the correct scores.
> > >
> >
> > Did you run on Linux? (I assume yes).
> > Also, how good was your RAM? I wonder how much that influences the GB5
> > result, given how absurdly variable they are for the same CPUs.
> >
>
>
> Yes, I run Linux and most GB5 Linux scores are indeed typically higher than
> almost all Windows scores, especially for single-thread, even if, for most CPUs,
> there are also a few Windows scores in the range of the Linux scores.
>
> While the real cause for this is unknown, my opinion is that this is due to the lack of
> control in Windows of which programs run on the computer. There are a myriad of Windows
> services that wake up and run whenever they desire, without control from the computer owner
> and also various other extra junk services, e.g. anti-viruses or telemetry programs.
>
> I believe that these Windows services interfere randomly with the single-threaded benchmarks,
> while on a well-configured Linux you may be certain enough that you will have not have undesirable
> daemons running when you do not want them to run. This is consistent with the fact that I have
> also seen a few high Windows scores, with values similar to the Linux scores.
>
> My memory is very slow, DDR4-2667, because the upgraded computer was built in 2019, when there were no
> faster ECC UDIMMs. Now DDR4-3200 ECC UDIMMs have appeared, but I have not upgraded the memory yet.
>
> As it is well known, Ryzen is particularly sensitive to memory speed, because
> the communication links between chiplets run at the memory speed.
>
> I assume that due to the very slow memory, my own GB5 score was only 1790 @ 4.8 GHz (frequency
> from the .gb5 file), while I have seen a lot of other Linux GB5 scores above 1800 and up
> to 1876. Moreover, when comparing with the other higher Zen 3 GB5 scores, many subtests were
> the same, just a few tests were lower on my sample, e.g. the encryption test, and that is
> consistent with the supposition that my score was lowered by the slow memory.
>
> Nevertheless even my score, which is low for a Ryzen 9 5900X under Linux, due to the
> slow memory, was significantly higher than the best Apple M1 score, which is 1752.
>

Interesting, so it was actually with a non-fast RAM (I assume the timings/subtimings were not tweaked to death either, then).

>
> On Ryzen, an extra cause for variability is the core on which GB5 happens to run the tests. I do not know
> how the core is selected, but I do not believe that the best core is chosen, at least on Linux. On my CPU,
> the best 2 or 3 cores have single-thread frequencies between 4.85 and 4.95 GHz, depending on core temperature,
> while the slowest cores have frequencies between 4.75 and 4.85 GHz, so I believe that the GB5 test happened
> to run in my case on one of the slower cores of my CPU, while the fastest GB5 results from the database
> have been run on fast cores, mostly at 4.9 or 4.95 GHz, or even up to 5.05 GHz on a 5950X.
>
> I believe that GB5 pins the tests to a single core, because the clock frequency is constant during the tests,
> but I am not aware if there is any method on Linux to determine automatically which are the fastest cores.
> I know that there is some support for the Intel Turbo 3.0, which works similarly for Intel, but even for Intel
> I do not know if the existing Linux support provides a way to discover which are the fastest cores.
>
> On Linux, with the default scheduler, if you do not pin explicitly a process to a core, it is
> migrated randomly across all cores, so on Ryzen the clock frequency would change whenever passing
> to a new core, because each core might have a different maximum turbo clock frequency.
>
>
>
>
> > IRRC GB5 scores way higher on MacOS and it is also scoring higher on the same hardware under
> > Linux compared to Windows. The reviews of M1 generally compared MacOS result to AMD/Intel
> > result under Windows - a mistake arguably, making M1 looking faster than it really is.
> >
> >
> > > Therefore now it is clear that a desktop Zen 3 is faster in single-thread
> > > than Apple M1 (obviously at a much greater power per core, of over 20 W).
> > >
> > >
> > > For example, in GB5 ST, Zen 3 is faster by about 2% @ 4.8 GHz (e.g. 1790
> > > vs. 1752) and up to about 7% @ 5.05 GHz (over 1850, up to 1876).
> > >
> > > In computational benchmarks where the number and speed of the available execution resources matter
> > > most, unlike in GB5 or SPEC, where the higher *average* IPC of Apple shines, the advantage of Zen
> > > 3 over Apple M1 increases, being e.g. of over 14% @ 4.9 GHz for gmpbench (7337 vs. 6422).
> > >
> >
>
>

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TopicPosted ByDate
Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Phil9955112020/12/29 06:12 AM
  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Adrian2020/12/29 08:31 AM
    Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Dummond D. Slow2020/12/29 11:33 AM
      Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Phil9955112020/12/29 05:09 PM
        Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Dummond D. Slow2020/12/29 07:00 PM
          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor anon2020/12/30 03:50 AM
          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Foo_2020/12/30 03:50 AM
            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Phil9955112020/12/30 06:22 AM
              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Phil9955112020/12/30 06:25 AM
              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Adrian2020/12/30 07:00 AM
            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Linus Torvalds2020/12/30 01:00 PM
              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Phil9955112020/12/31 07:45 AM
                Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Adrian2020/12/31 10:49 AM
                Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Linus Torvalds2020/12/31 01:05 PM
                  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor me2020/12/31 05:56 PM
                    Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Anon2020/12/31 06:48 PM
                      Ryzen 9 5000 series processor me2021/01/01 05:06 AM
                    Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Gabriele Svelto2021/01/01 08:10 AM
                      Ryzen 9 5000 series processor David Hess2021/01/01 08:37 AM
                        Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jukka Larja2021/01/01 11:52 AM
                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Linus Torvalds2021/01/01 01:48 PM
                            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jukka Larja2021/01/01 11:28 PM
                              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Linus Torvalds2021/01/02 01:21 PM
                                Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Adrian2021/01/02 02:17 PM
                                Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Anon2021/01/02 07:08 PM
                                Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jukka Larja2021/01/03 12:10 AM
                                  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor David Hess2021/01/03 02:03 AM
                                    Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jukka Larja2021/01/03 04:28 AM
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                                    Threadrippers do have official ECC supportBjörn Ragnar Björnsson2021/01/04 09:21 AM
                                ECC (or lack of)Tim McCaffrey2021/01/03 10:28 AM
                                  ECC (or lack of)Adrian2021/01/03 02:14 PM
                                    ECC (or lack of)Yuhong Bao2021/01/03 02:51 PM
                                      ECC (or lack of)Yuhong Bao2021/01/04 07:54 PM
                                        ECC (or lack of)Yuhong Bao2021/01/04 08:04 PM
                                AMD ECC not enabled but says it isIan Cutress2021/01/03 12:09 PM
                                  AMD ECC not enabled but says it isMaxwell2021/01/03 01:28 PM
                                  AMD ECC not enabled but says it isAdrian2021/01/03 01:50 PM
                                    AMD ECC not enabled but says it isGabriele Svelto2021/01/03 02:08 PM
                                      AMD ECC not enabled but says it isAdrian2021/01/03 02:34 PM
                                        AMD ECC not enabled but says it isDan Strother2021/01/03 08:00 PM
                                          AMD ECC not enabled but says it isMatt2021/01/04 01:29 AM
                                          AMD ECC not enabled but says it isGabriele Svelto2021/01/04 02:29 AM
                                            AMD ECC not enabled but says it isMatt2021/01/04 01:39 PM
                                          AMD ECC not enabled but says it isAdrian2021/01/04 06:49 AM
                                Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jason Snyder2021/01/04 02:44 PM
                                  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Brett2021/01/04 06:08 PM
                                  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Linus Torvalds2021/01/05 01:29 PM
                                    Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Adrian2021/01/05 02:08 PM
                                    Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Emil Briggs2021/01/05 05:40 PM
                                      Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Gabriele Svelto2021/01/06 02:12 AM
                                    Ryzen 9 5000 series processor [ECC summary - Suitable for framing]Björn Ragnar Björnsson2021/01/05 07:29 PM
                                    Ryzen 9 5000 series processor 2021/01/06 10:45 AM
                                      Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Linus Torvalds2021/01/06 12:38 PM
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                                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jörn Engel2021/01/07 10:05 AM
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                                              Read Only Page Correctionsrwessel2021/01/07 12:00 PM
                                                Read Only Page CorrectionsTerry Gray2021/01/07 12:58 PM
                                              Read Only Page CorrectionsDavid Hess2021/01/10 08:37 PM
                                              Read Only Page Correctionsdmcq2021/01/11 04:32 AM
                                        Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Chester2021/01/07 06:00 AM
                                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Gabriele Svelto2021/01/07 06:33 AM
                                            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Michael S2021/01/07 09:05 AM
                                              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Linus Torvalds2021/01/07 11:26 AM
                                            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor rwessel2021/01/07 10:06 AM
                                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Linus Torvalds2021/01/07 11:04 AM
                                            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Chester2021/01/07 05:19 PM
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                                                OT L1 chache ECCAdrian2021/01/08 09:54 AM
                                                  OT L1 chache ECCDavid Kanter2021/01/08 10:13 AM
                                                    Structure ProtectionsChester2021/01/08 03:14 PM
                                            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Etienne Lorrain2021/01/08 02:18 AM
                                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Björn Ragnar Björnsson2021/01/07 06:42 PM
                                            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Chester2021/01/07 09:14 PM
                                              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Björn Ragnar Björnsson2021/01/07 09:26 PM
                                                Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Michael S2021/01/08 03:49 AM
                                    Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jason Snyder2021/01/14 08:32 AM
                                      Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Gabriele Svelto2021/01/15 06:26 AM
                                        Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jason Snyder2021/01/16 11:45 AM
                                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jason Snyder2021/01/16 01:27 PM
                              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Etienne Lorrain2021/01/07 02:21 AM
                                Ryzen 9 5000 series processor anon2021/01/07 03:21 AM
                                  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Etienne Lorrain2021/01/07 04:22 AM
                                    Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Konrad Schwarz2021/01/07 06:27 AM
                                  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Adrian2021/01/07 05:22 AM
                                  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor rwessel2021/01/07 10:25 AM
                                    Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jörn Engel2021/01/07 05:29 PM
                                      Ryzen 9 5000 series processor rwessel2021/01/07 07:47 PM
                                        Ryzen 9 5000 series processor David Hess2021/01/11 05:26 AM
                                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Adrian2021/01/11 06:25 AM
                                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor rwessel2021/01/11 08:24 AM
                                      Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Mark Roulo2021/01/07 08:00 PM
                                        Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Björn Ragnar Björnsson2021/01/07 08:20 PM
                                  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor David Hess2021/01/11 05:16 AM
                      Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jukka Larja2021/01/01 11:43 AM
                        Ryzen 9 5000 series processor David Hess2021/01/01 01:31 PM
                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Dan Strother2021/01/01 02:12 PM
                        Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Adrian2021/01/01 02:28 PM
                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor vs. M1Adrian2021/01/02 03:45 AM
                            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor vs. M1Dummond D. Slow2021/01/02 01:50 PM
                              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor vs. M1Adrian2021/01/02 03:00 PM
                                Ryzen 9 5000 series processor vs. M1Dummond D. Slow2021/01/04 01:11 PM
                            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor vs. M1Dummond D. Slow2021/01/07 11:43 AM
                              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor vs. M1Adrian2021/01/08 09:28 AM
                                Ryzen 9 5000 series processor vs. M1 Sorry, typo, correction hereAdrian2021/01/08 09:31 AM
                                  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor vs. M1 (vs. Rocket Lake)Dummond D. Slow2021/01/22 08:02 AM
                            isn't that an interesting contradiction?hobold2021/01/08 01:44 PM
                              isn't that an interesting contradiction?Maynard Handley2021/01/08 02:27 PM
                              isn't that an interesting contradiction?Adrian2021/01/08 03:21 PM
                                isn't that an interesting contradiction?Maynard Handley2021/01/08 04:59 PM
                                  isn't that an interesting contradiction?Maynard Handley2021/01/08 05:34 PM
                                    isn't that an interesting contradiction?Maynard Handley2021/01/08 05:34 PM
                                    isn't that an interesting contradiction?Maynard Handley2021/01/08 05:35 PM
                                      isn't that an interesting contradiction?Adrian2021/01/09 01:55 AM
                                  isn't that an interesting contradiction?Adrian2021/01/09 01:48 AM
                                    isn't that an interesting contradiction? - gmpAdrian2021/01/09 09:00 AM
                                      isn't that an interesting contradiction? - gmpnone2021/01/11 02:26 AM
                                        isn't that an interesting contradiction? - gmpAdrian2021/01/11 05:34 AM
                                          Fully agree with you, I was just giving some data :-) (NT)none2021/01/11 06:17 AM
                                          isn't that an interesting contradiction? - gmpanon2021/01/11 01:09 PM
                                            isn't that an interesting contradiction? - gmpAdrian2021/01/12 01:54 AM
                                              isn't that an interesting contradiction? - gmpnone2021/01/12 02:15 AM
                                                isn't that an interesting contradiction? - gmpAdrian2021/01/12 04:37 AM
                                                  isn't that an interesting contradiction? - gmpnone2021/01/12 04:53 AM
                                                    uses of int multiplyhobold2021/01/12 03:51 PM
                                                      uses of int multiplynone2021/01/13 02:11 AM
                                                      uses of int multiplyJörn Engel2021/01/13 01:06 PM
                                                  isn't that an interesting contradiction? - gmpWilco2021/01/12 05:17 AM
                                                    isn't that an interesting contradiction? - gmpAdrian2021/01/12 06:07 AM
                        Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Gabriele Svelto2021/01/01 04:31 PM
                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jukka Larja2021/01/01 10:58 PM
                            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Gabriele Svelto2021/01/02 06:51 AM
                              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jukka Larja2021/01/02 08:57 AM
                                Ryzen 9 5000 series processor me2021/01/02 05:30 PM
                                  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jukka Larja2021/01/02 11:43 PM
                        Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Björn Ragnar Björnsson2021/01/01 09:41 PM
                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jukka Larja2021/01/01 10:53 PM
                            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Adrian2021/01/02 02:03 AM
                              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jukka Larja2021/01/02 08:39 AM
                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Adrian2021/01/02 01:52 AM
                          Ryzen 9 5000 series processor me2021/01/02 06:56 AM
                            Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Michael S2021/01/02 12:41 PM
                              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Adrian2021/01/02 01:43 PM
                              Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Jukka Larja2021/01/02 11:50 PM
                          Crucial/Micron ECC UDIMMsGabriele Svelto2021/01/02 07:09 AM
                            Crucial/Micron ECC UDIMMsMaxwell2021/01/02 10:45 AM
                              Crucial/Micron ECC UDIMMsYuhong Bao2021/01/02 07:29 PM
                  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor Phil9955112021/01/03 08:46 AM
  Ryzen 9 5000 series processor H_Heckuba2021/01/03 01:06 PM
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