By: Brendan (btrotter.delete@this.gmail.com), January 29, 2023 1:00 pm
Room: Moderated Discussions
Hi,
Groo (charlie.delete@this.semiaccurate.com) on January 29, 2023 8:46 am wrote:
> anonymou5 (no.delete@this.spam.com) on January 28, 2023 3:03 am wrote:
> > > Why they have not followed the standard methodology in this field, is a mystery.
> >
> > They did.
> >
> > The bug in question was of a different nature, and missed because of a different chain of circumstances.
>
> If you are talking about the bug that delayed SPR from Q3(barely) to Q1/23 (barely), I totally agree. I
> know specifically what the bug was and was the first to report it for Intel last May. SPR is enormously
> complex, stunningly so and, well, good luck testing all interactions of all the parts pre-silicon.
>
> I will stand by what I said last May, Intel did the right thing to delay SPR. They took a lot of sh*t
> for it but it was the right thing to do.
Intel take a lot of shit because they continually fail to learn from the previous 20+ years of assuming complexity can be increased beyond what anyone on earth can manage and then suffering the inevitable consequences.
Every year Intel say "Yay, we have a new product that's more complex than any product ever before" quickly followed by "Oops, our new product is buggy"; and then after its too late they improve their processes (validation, etc) to deal with the current amount of complexity (but not the future complexity) without ever doing a single thing to try to contain or reduce the ever-growing complexity (e.g. discontinuing things like TSX and SGX, and instead adding a whole pile of new "secure uncrippling and payment processing" complexity for Intel On Demand).
At this point; saying "they did the right thing when dealing with inevitable consequences of problems they caused" is like saying a 50 year old toddler did the right thing AFTER hitting their thumb with a hammer for the 50th time in a row.
- Brendan
Groo (charlie.delete@this.semiaccurate.com) on January 29, 2023 8:46 am wrote:
> anonymou5 (no.delete@this.spam.com) on January 28, 2023 3:03 am wrote:
> > > Why they have not followed the standard methodology in this field, is a mystery.
> >
> > They did.
> >
> > The bug in question was of a different nature, and missed because of a different chain of circumstances.
>
> If you are talking about the bug that delayed SPR from Q3(barely) to Q1/23 (barely), I totally agree. I
> know specifically what the bug was and was the first to report it for Intel last May. SPR is enormously
> complex, stunningly so and, well, good luck testing all interactions of all the parts pre-silicon.
>
> I will stand by what I said last May, Intel did the right thing to delay SPR. They took a lot of sh*t
> for it but it was the right thing to do.
Intel take a lot of shit because they continually fail to learn from the previous 20+ years of assuming complexity can be increased beyond what anyone on earth can manage and then suffering the inevitable consequences.
Every year Intel say "Yay, we have a new product that's more complex than any product ever before" quickly followed by "Oops, our new product is buggy"; and then after its too late they improve their processes (validation, etc) to deal with the current amount of complexity (but not the future complexity) without ever doing a single thing to try to contain or reduce the ever-growing complexity (e.g. discontinuing things like TSX and SGX, and instead adding a whole pile of new "secure uncrippling and payment processing" complexity for Intel On Demand).
At this point; saying "they did the right thing when dealing with inevitable consequences of problems they caused" is like saying a 50 year old toddler did the right thing AFTER hitting their thumb with a hammer for the 50th time in a row.
- Brendan
Topic | Posted By | Date |
---|---|---|
NYT on SPR | --- | 2023/01/26 10:37 AM |
NYT on SPR | Chris G | 2023/01/26 06:02 PM |
NYT on SPR | me | 2023/01/26 07:44 PM |
NYT on SPR | Anne O. Nymous | 2023/01/27 01:09 AM |
NYT on SPR | Michael S | 2023/01/27 03:22 AM |
NYT on SPR | --- | 2023/01/27 10:31 AM |
Pat has been trimming the Intel product portfolio | Mark Roulo | 2023/01/27 01:29 PM |
NYT on SPR | James | 2023/01/27 02:00 PM |
NYT on SPR | Adrian | 2023/01/28 03:55 AM |
NYT on SPR | anonymou5 | 2023/01/28 04:03 AM |
NYT on SPR | Adrian | 2023/01/28 04:14 AM |
NYT on SPR | Groo | 2023/01/29 09:50 AM |
NYT on SPR | Groo | 2023/01/29 09:46 AM |
NYT on SPR | Brendan | 2023/01/29 01:00 PM |
NYT on SPR | Anon4 | 2023/01/29 04:06 PM |
NYT on SPR | Brendan | 2023/01/29 07:03 PM |
NYT on SPR | Groo | 2023/01/30 07:09 AM |
NYT on SPR | Groo | 2023/01/29 09:39 AM |
NYT on SPR | AnonSoft | 2023/01/30 11:01 AM |
NYT on SPR | hobold | 2023/01/30 12:39 PM |
NYT on SPR | AnonSoft | 2023/01/30 05:34 PM |
NYT on SPR | hobold | 2023/01/31 04:40 AM |
NYT on SPR | Jukka Larja | 2023/01/31 07:13 AM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | Mark Heath | 2023/02/01 04:45 AM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | Freddie | 2023/02/01 05:05 AM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | Mark Heath | 2023/02/01 06:42 AM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | Freddie | 2023/02/01 09:54 AM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | Mark Heath | 2023/02/01 04:45 PM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | —- | 2023/02/02 04:35 PM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | Freddie | 2023/02/02 04:39 PM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | --- | 2023/02/03 12:15 PM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | Freddie | 2023/02/03 03:46 PM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | Anne O. Nymous | 2023/02/03 12:57 AM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | --- | 2023/02/03 12:35 PM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | Anne O. Nymous | 2023/02/03 01:35 PM |
different big/little split.. | Heikki Kultala | 2023/02/03 02:33 PM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | Paul H | 2023/02/03 06:51 PM |
Heterogeneous CPU Cores With OpenMP | Jukka Larja | 2023/02/01 06:24 AM |
When heavily loaded, Threads run about equally fast on E-cores than P-cores | Heikki Kultala | 2023/02/01 02:08 PM |
NYT on SPR | Chester | 2023/01/27 09:30 AM |
use archive.org | anon | 2023/01/27 06:08 PM |
Bypassing paywalls | Doug S | 2023/01/28 02:05 PM |
NYT on SPR | Chris G | 2023/01/27 06:54 PM |
Intel On Demand | Chris G | 2023/01/28 04:24 AM |
Intel On Demand | me | 2023/01/28 06:24 AM |
Intel On Demand | Groo | 2023/01/29 09:53 AM |
Intel On Demand | rwessel | 2023/01/28 09:41 AM |
Intel On Demand | --- | 2023/01/28 11:37 AM |
Anit-waste bias | Paul A. Clayton | 2023/01/28 07:57 PM |
Intel On Demand | Groo | 2023/01/29 09:58 AM |
Intel On Demand | Andrey | 2023/01/30 05:04 PM |
Intel On Demand | blaine | 2023/01/28 03:07 PM |
Intel On Demand | me | 2023/01/28 03:25 PM |
Intel On Demand | me | 2023/01/28 03:33 PM |
Intel On Demand | Chris G | 2023/01/28 07:06 PM |
Intel On Demand | me | 2023/01/28 07:43 PM |
Intel On Demand - Validation, certification? | Björn Ragnar Björnsson | 2023/01/28 10:41 PM |
Intel On Demand - Validation, certification? | anonymou5 | 2023/01/29 02:49 AM |
Sapphire Rapids crippleware is a naked money grab | Chris G | 2023/01/29 04:44 AM |
Intel On Demand - Validation, certification? | Groo | 2023/01/29 10:05 AM |
Intel On Demand - Validation, certification? | AnotherAnonymousEngineer | 2023/01/29 10:33 AM |
Intel On Demand - Validation, certification? | Groo | 2023/01/29 11:16 AM |
Intel On Demand - Validation, certification? | dmcq | 2023/01/29 04:32 PM |
Intel On Demand - Validation, certification? | Brendan | 2023/01/29 08:01 PM |
Intel On Demand - Validation, certification? | Groo | 2023/01/30 07:17 AM |
Intel On Demand - Validation, certification? | Freddie | 2023/01/30 11:36 AM |
Intel On Demand - Validation, certification? | anon2 | 2023/01/30 07:41 PM |
Intel On Demand - Validation, certification? | anon2 | 2023/01/31 01:35 AM |
Crippleware | Chris G | 2023/01/31 05:47 AM |
Doctorow calls it "enshittification" (NT) | hobold | 2023/01/31 07:55 AM |
Crippleware | anon2 | 2023/01/31 10:51 AM |
Crippleware | Groo | 2023/02/01 02:06 PM |
Crippleware | anon2 | 2023/02/01 05:10 PM |
Crippleware | Chris G | 2023/02/01 05:52 PM |
Crippleware | anon2 | 2023/02/01 09:15 PM |
SPR Volume | me | 2023/02/02 04:47 AM |
SPR Volume | anon2 | 2023/02/02 07:04 AM |
Crippleware | Chris G | 2023/02/02 08:12 AM |
Crippleware | anon2 | 2023/02/02 08:42 AM |
Crippleware | anon2 | 2023/02/02 08:48 AM |
Crippleware | Charles | 2023/02/01 01:38 AM |
Crippleware | Chris G | 2023/02/01 02:59 AM |
language digression | Matt Sayler | 2023/02/01 04:53 PM |
Crippleware | me | 2023/02/01 06:27 PM |
Crippleware | Chris G | 2023/02/01 07:01 PM |
Crippleware | me | 2023/02/01 07:10 PM |
Crippleware | Chris G | 2023/02/01 09:32 PM |
Crippleware | Tony | 2023/02/01 11:18 PM |
Crippleware | me | 2023/02/02 04:27 AM |
Crippleware | anonymou5 | 2023/02/02 03:47 AM |
Crippleware | Chris G | 2023/02/02 05:59 AM |
Intel On Demand - Enshittification | blaine | 2023/01/30 12:13 AM |
Intel and mobile phones | James | 2023/01/29 09:09 AM |
Intel and mobile phones | Maxwell | 2023/01/29 02:25 PM |
Intel and mobile phones | Groo | 2023/01/30 07:20 AM |
Intel and mobile phones | anonymous2 | 2023/01/30 11:15 AM |
Intel and mobile phones | Doug S | 2023/01/30 12:51 PM |
Intel and mobile phones | Daniel B | 2023/01/31 07:37 AM |
Intel and mobile phones | Groo | 2023/02/01 02:03 PM |
SPR HBM | me | 2023/01/29 09:17 AM |
SPR-W | me | 2023/02/17 05:41 PM |
Accelerators on AMD/ARM | Chester | 2023/01/29 05:41 PM |