Atom to stay in-oder or go OoO?

By: AM (myname4rwt.delete@this.jee.male), October 3, 2009 6:22 am
Room: Moderated Discussions
Ungo (a@b.c.d.e) on 10/2/09 wrote:
---------------------------
>AM (myname4rwt@jee.male) on 10/1/09 wrote:
>---------------------------
>>>>But if you're looking for the most common Atom bin by number of
>>>>>chips shipped to date, that would be the N270 (2.5W @ 1.60GHz), the backbone of the netbook revolution.
>>>>
>>>>Source?
>>>
>>>Just look up the specs of almost _any_ Atom netbook. If it's 1.6 GHz (and most
>>>of them are), it's either a N270 or (if introduced recently) a Z530.
>>>
>>>Here, let me help you with a link to an amazon search for N270 in the netbook category
>>>(Amazon's not a bad point of reference since they carry most if not all of the major netbook brands):
>>>
>>>http://tinyurl.com/y9d7xx2
>>>
>>>Then go and try to find any Atom 230 netbooks on Amazon. I dare you...
>>>
>>>(Hint: don't waste your time.)
>>
>>BS. Show me numbers of chips sold (unless you simply made it up).
>
>1. Netbooks are the volume driver for Atom (do you have a better candidate?)
>
>2. If you survey netbooks, you will find that most netbook models have a 1.6GHz
>2.5W N270. The remainder have a Z530 or other Z series chip.
>
>3. During that same survey, you will find zero models (or, at least, I have yet
>to find a single one) which use a 1.6GHz 4W 230.
>
>Are any of these things not factual? If not, what do these facts add up to, in your oh so humble opinion?
>
>Do I have exact sales figures? No, and I never claimed to, nor did I invent any.

Really?

>>>>But if you're looking for the most common Atom bin by number of
>>>>>chips shipped to date,
that would be the N270

Try harder, "ungo".

>This is just simple logic: if most products in the market segment which is probably
>90% or more of Atom's volume use the N270, then obviously N270 is the high volume
>bin, not some kind of special unobtanium bin created only by heroic sorting efforts.
>
>You assumed that when there are two power bins that must mean the lower one is
>always special and the higher one is the mainstream bin. You were simply wrong. Is it so hard for you to admit that?
>
>Here's a little exercise for you. Go here:
>
>http://ark.intel.com/SSPECQDF.aspx
>
>Set "Brand" to Atom. Now, look all the way on the left. What market segment is
>N270 identified as? What market segment is Atom 230?

What is this, Intel's Atom PR dept. posting here?

>>>>>>is clearly worse if you consider there have been 10W DC 1.6 GHz 3M Core2s (SU9600) for some time. And quickly checking for benchmarks vs Core2, e.g. I used this: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-atom-efficiency,2069-8.html
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>it appears low-power 2.5W bin hardly makes it a winner on the metric it was allegedly
>>>>>>optimized for. And power-efficiency at platform level -- just forget it.
>>>>>
>>>>>The THG article you linked to compares the performance of a 65W TDP 2.53GHz C2D
>>>>>to a 4W 1.6GHz Atom 230, not a 10W 1.6GHz SU9600 to a 2.5W 1.6GHz N270 as you imply.
>>>>
>>>>Oh, and what would be the performance of the 10W part? :)
>>>
>>>Why don't you tell me? It's up to you to support your argument. Don't ask me
>>>to do your legwork for you, it only makes you smell more trollish than you already do.
>>
>>I don't expect the performance of lower-power bin of a Core 2 chip to be any different
>>from that of higher-power bin of the same.
>
>"of the same" what? Clock frequency?
>
>You do realize that 2.53GHz != 1.60GHz, don't you?

same chip, same clock rate. isn't it obvious?

>>And what do we see? Even the original 1.5 GHz Pentium 4 at the bottom of the page
>>is "Launched" -- just like Z series Atom. :)
>>
>>Wait, it's not just "launched", but listed as available at $129! Which of Intel's dealers has some in stock? :D
>
>So let's make this clear: you believe that if there isn't a price listed and it
>says N/A instead, it's an old CPU which is unavailable, or in the process of becoming so?
>
>Do you realize that a ton of those Atoms which have a 'N/A' price were 'launched'
>in Q2 2009?

Oh yes, and apparently in Q3 they were no longer listed neither in Intel's price list, nor on the ark page.

I don't think it signifies anything other than Intel choosing not to
>list a 1k budgetary price estimate for every CPU.

Do you speak for Intel? :) One other document where Z atoms are not to be found (even though Intel apparently keeps supplying Dell and a few other customers) is their official price list.

>If you click various processor families (plain Pentium is a good one) you'll find
>that what they do to products which are in the process of exiting this mortal coil
>is to mark them "End of Life" in the Status column.
>
>Those old moldy Pentium 4 models probably aren't having their information updated because nobody cares.
>
>>>>surprizing part has to do with it doesn't seem to
>>>>win in power efficiency either vs Core2.
>>>
>>>The methodology by which you reached this conclusion is terrible, IMO. You should
>>>have at least tried to find a comparison between SU9600 and N270, or tried to find
>>>separate benchmarks of similar methodology. (Actually, SU3500 would be a better
>>>choice of C2D than SU9600, so you could compare one core to one core.)
>>
>>So what is it you don't like about the methodology? I didn't perform my own measurements,
>>I rely on Intel's figures and measurements done by others, for me this is enough.
>
>You didn't measure or find measurements of the mobile ULV C2D you identified as
>an exemplar of potential C2D power efficiency. Instead, you linked to measurements
>of a much faster 65W TDP desktop C2D.
>
>And you wonder why I call you a troll.

I really do, because I just don't see why bother about comparing an ULV part for the sake of CPU performance when there's non-ULV perf data?

Power -- yes, and one thing I find most enertaining about Atom is how it looks against 65W Core2 on power efficiency.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-atom-efficiency,2069.html
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